'Inspiral Carpet Burns' w/ Tom Hingley

[00:00:00] Speaker A: You call that radio? [00:00:02] Speaker B: YCTR Season 6, episode 10. Season 6, episode 10. And it's a very interesting one. This had Tom Hingley, formerly of the Inspiral Carpets, definitely formerly of the Inspiral Carpets. We had a bit of chat for a bit, I don't know, 10 minutes, and then asked him a question and he just. He just spoke. It was an easy shift for me. I only had to Google Skegness. But this is Tom Henley spilling the beans and burning some bridges, no doubt. And hope I don't get involved in the crossfire because it seems a bit. A bit dramatic, you know. You know that I'm not the. The drama podcast guy. I avoid it. I. I don't. I just stay out it. I'm not James English. I'm not bringing on people who say controversial things. I don't. I don't want it. I don't want the money, the fame, the drama. But I feel like this was quite a dramatic episode, you know, in Spiral Carpets. Even if you don't think, you know, in Spiral Carpets, you'll know this is how it feels to be lonely Dragging me down Psalm 5. Loads of hats. Loads of hats from the Baggy Madchester generation, an iconic band from the Hacienda, along with peers like growing up with the Stone Roses, the Happy Mondays, the Charlatans. No, Gallagher used to be the roadie. Well, there's a claim to fame for you. And I had Tom in the show, I think, back in. Well, we know when it was, September 2021, because we checked it and it was a very entertaining episode. He kind of spoke for about two hours. It was mostly politics and he didn't really talk about the band that much, but he talks about the band a lot in this one. I would say he talks about the band for the entirety of this episode. So if you're. If you're in Spiral Carpets, if you're into Tom Hengley or you're in any of the bands from that golden era, then this is fascinating to listen to. And even if you're not, if you're just into band politics and why. What is it about being in a band that kind of puts you off the people that you're in a bandwidth. But it's a. It's a very common thread that happens. I don't know, something to do with adrenaline, being in a close space. It's like the family. They love each other, they hate each other. It's. It's. It's. It's interesting. So, yeah, thanks to the patrons before we start. That's the reason there'll be no adverts on the show. We don't do adverts. We've got no sponsors, we've got no funding. There's nothing because of the generosity of the patrons. So if you want to support the show, our events, our YouTube channel, everything we do is powered by the [email protected] ucallthatradio thank you. There'll be no more adverts. Now strap in and enjoy. Tom Henley, you are tuned into YCT [00:03:30] Speaker A: Abbas and I think. [00:03:33] Speaker B: I think you can hear me now. [00:03:34] Speaker A: I think I can hear you, yeah. Yeah. It reminds me of when I couldn't hear you. [00:03:38] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:03:39] Speaker A: I did a gig in Athens. We did two nights at a club in Athens and I went swimming one night and got water all behind the wax of my ears. And the next day I couldn't hear a single thing at the gig at all. This is in spiral carbs. And then the gig, mine said it was my hearing came back in the last chorus and the last song we did after the entire gig. And I quite often use the way the vibration sounds in my head to tell whether I'm in tune or not. And mine said, that was a good gig. I said, I don't know, was it? I didn't hear any of it. I don't know if it was a good gig or not, actually. [00:04:10] Speaker B: I. I got. I had lost the year of one year playing a gig once, and it was just. I think it was just a wax builder. But still, every two years I go and get the ear Hoover and it's a very strange experience. What do you think about earplugs as well? It's like I've always just started getting tinnitus. But I used to. What I used to try and do is. I mean, I didn't wear earplugs at all when I was younger, but I started getting worse and worse. So what I did was I would wear them before and after I was on stage, but always felt a wee bit off wearing them. [00:04:42] Speaker A: I know that for three years I mispronounced the word tinnitus. I thought it was Titanus, but maybe it's a judgment on my soul that no one corrected me. There was a funny thing, actually, that when the lockdown happened, my friend Pete, who plays drums for Paul Heat, and his brother came on Facebook and he said, because obviously it was really quiet. And I remember waking up one morning in that beginning of that lockdown in 2020, exactly like six years ago, and I could hear all these wood pigeons talking to another. You could hear one wood pigeon talking to another one like quarter of a mile away and then. And you could hear loads stuff depth of sound you couldn't normally. So anyway, so Andy, who's Pete's brother, went on, he came on Facebook, he said I can hear all this puzzling. I can hear all this noise. What is it? Is it a pipe under the ground? I said, it's tinnitus, mate. You can just hear it because the background noise is so quiet. There is like a medic. The. If you're. I know a lot of people aren't in favor of the musicians union, but I mean I am and also my wife work the musicians union so. So they do a thing where you can get. So you can get your ear molded and then they make like a proper. [00:05:45] Speaker B: You got the ear test and I got my own ear earplugs molded. Unfortunately I lost one and you can't buy just one. And they said something like contact the person who did the ear. And maybe they've got your ear mold on file, I don't know. But I just go, you know what, I just go for the. I go for the loops, I just go for 15, 20 pounds ones and then if I lose them. [00:06:08] Speaker A: I think the lesson is in life if you're a musician is to go for a partner who's an ear fetishist because they never lose like your ear mold, would they? Yeah, they worship. They put your ear mold like on a little stage with a little cup of incense burning around it and they probably do unspeakable things to it, you know. [00:06:27] Speaker B: But yeah. So how are you doing anyway? What's been happening? [00:06:31] Speaker A: What's been happening? The kids are off school, we've got an outhouse. I've got a guy called Floyd to come and lay an electrical cable out so that we can have a light out there and turn it into a little. Well, I promised the kids about eight years ago that'd be a Wendy House. Now they're all into being on screen so they probably won't give a shit about it really. But we've just got this bit of light out there and a bit of cabling out there. So I've been digging very, very, in a very middle class way a trench to put the cable in. It's a bit like. It's a bit like a version of the Good Life or something done by a slightly overweight 60 year old bloke in. In Trafford, if you can imagine that. [00:07:09] Speaker B: Oh, that. I don't need to imagine it's, it's happening right now. I, I had, I had my first middle class issue ever. I had, I made a. I've got a smoothie machine and I blended. I blended cherries into the pips and then I learned that there's actually cyanide in it. So then I thought I'd. I thought I'd gonna dive a cyanide overdose and maybe would have believed that. [00:07:34] Speaker A: Yeah, I mean the thing about it is it's not just a cyanide poisoning is it's, it's like a Marks and Spencer's cyanide poisoning. That's, that's the way you have to look at it. [00:07:43] Speaker B: Yeah, it was the Co Op. It was from the Co Op, but. [00:07:48] Speaker A: Okay. [00:07:48] Speaker B: But it was blended. I mean I had, I had. The smoothie had other ingredients. It had spinach. I had maybe kill bananas, strawberries. So I was, it was a medical. [00:08:01] Speaker A: There's any way you could give it to Michael McIntyre? [00:08:05] Speaker B: What? I don't know if it's about Michael McIntyre. I remember him with a floppy hair. He burst on at the scene. But that was really the time that the Internet started happening. So I've not been forced to watch, [00:08:16] Speaker A: I think, I mean this is this much. It might. Sorry to talk over your mark, but it might sound like a homophobic comment. It isn't. But I think he's come. Some people have a comedy set up, you know, like Ricky Gervais, he's a really humanist, so he'll attack religion or he'll attack faith in, you know, he's basically humanist. He doesn't believe there's any architecture, any, there's any gods. He just believes that humans ought to treat one another properly. And that's why he goes on about animal rights and stuff. But, you know, that's quite a complex comedy and he offends people because he's testing like, you know, because the thing about taboos is that we all know what taboos are about, we just don't mention it. [00:08:50] Speaker B: But the thing about Ricky Gervais though, he's always so. I mean, obviously the Office was brilliant. Extras had some great moments, but I find that he kind of fits into the whole the American thing with the Joe Rogan thing where it's like, oh, punching down energy. I'm gonna get can. Yeah, punch him down. And then going, oh, I'm canceled. [00:09:10] Speaker A: Yeah, I was using it as an example though. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I agree with you. So Michael McIntyre, his entire comedy setup is that he's a middle class bloke he's metrosexual. So if he worked in a post office or he worked in the Department of Work and Pensions or he worked somewhere else, workingclass women would probably think he's gay. But he's not. That's his entire comedy setup. It's not exactly Groucho Marx, is it? Bloody hell. [00:09:40] Speaker B: I'm sure he does well. I'm sure he does well. It's. He seems like that kind of mainstream British comedian. [00:09:47] Speaker A: He's a sort of common material, to be fair. Actually. [00:09:51] Speaker B: I've just seen a lot of panel shows here and there. I don't really know. I wouldn't imagine. I wouldn't. I wouldn't bet money on it being good. [00:09:59] Speaker A: It's not as good as Paddy McGinnis. You know Paddy McGinnis, he's a professional man. He comes from Bolton and he, you know, he does like in the factory, you know, like, you know he'll go to like a factory who makes lawnmowers and he'll just, you know, talk in this bolt and axe about lawnmowers. But I'd like to see him go to like Porton down and drink some green monkey disease or maybe go a cellophel or maybe drink a bit of polonium210 or something like that. I think that would be quite interesting. [00:10:22] Speaker B: Are we talking ap. [00:10:25] Speaker A: Well, we're talking about radioactive isotopes, but yeah, you could probably get them in IPAs. Anyway. What did. What do you want to talk about, Mark? Cuz you can know. I know I could talk behind legs off a donkey. Sorry. [00:10:35] Speaker B: Like you talked you. The last time you were on the show you spoke for two hours. I didn't. I didn't have to say anything. I was. It was great. [00:10:41] Speaker A: I can't do that tonight because I'm going to a gig and it's Marlon Williams, who's this Kiwi singer singing a Mary and Kelly, who's. My wife has arranged a babysitter and if I mess it up I will probably be turned into Kiwi shoe polish myself or something. So it'll only be an hour and 59 minutes tonight. I'm sorry about that. [00:11:01] Speaker B: We'll keep you long. The. But yeah. You're requested back. People wanted you back so I've not. I don't watch any of my shows back so I can't see. I'd skip through it there quickly to see what the. How long ago it was. It was September 2021. You were saying that we were. We were going to be stuck in an eternal one Tory Nation, which you were right by default because the labor turned into the Tories and all the Tories went in reform. So, yeah, that's pretty much bang on. You predict. [00:11:31] Speaker A: Yeah. If you want to. If you want to guess for, like, what might happen in the next general election, I don't think reform is strong enough to form a majority government. And I think if they do end up being in part of some kind of coalition government, the party that will eventually put them in place will be the Green Party. The Green Party that give them the last couple of seats to form a minority government. Because. Because the Green Party, like Zach Polanski, looks good on paper, but it's just like he's a bit like, look, you know, I mean, my view, and I'm not. I've not got a view on what goes on in Scotland because I'm not Scottish, but my view is, and this is going to make everyone groan, is that people need to get back into the Labour Party and they need to actually turn it back into a Labor Party from inside. And it's something I'm trying to get involved in some local community politics, like just the very micro avenue of where the road where we live, I just want to make it cleaner. I just want to find somewhere where the council will give us, somewhere where we can. It's not very rock and roll, but where we can sort through rubbish like wood and plastic and metal and take it to somewhere where they'll take it away. What I don't want to do is spend two days clearing up the area, drive up to the dump and then try and charge me 500 quid because they think that it's industrial, you know, it's commercial waste. That's the bit I'm not prop. Prepared to do, you know, and the other thing we're trying to do around here is, you know, Man United don't have any. We live very near United's ground and Man United don't have any bins near the bus stops, probably because, you know, some paramilitary organization blew one up in 1981. It's bloody 50 years ago. Just put some bloody bins next to bus stops. [00:13:06] Speaker B: The last time you were on here, you were comparing Brexiteers to the Taliban and now we're talking about bins. Have you. Have you mellowed it? Have you mellowed it? [00:13:17] Speaker A: I have mellowed out a little bit. I mean, I took a bit of a chill. I mean, I've not had a very chilled 26 hours, but anyway. [00:13:23] Speaker B: Oh, I shouldn't. That's right. That's where. Let's get back to the point. The reason, the reason I contacted you is it's been a topic of conversation that we've been talking about over the last few weeks on the show because there's a few people that have been going to see, you know, older bands and the chat, the lineup's completely changed and it's like, at what point, you know, you've got. You've even got the younger bands like Sugar Babes, who've changed every single band member. So it's. And obviously then I seen your, your, your Facebook rant, which was, which was spectacular. And thank you. So I really enjoyed it. And so I just wanted to sort of get your opinion on it because I've just. I've just. We. We just had a farewell gig last year and I kind of had the feeling that were getting rewarded and congratulated for being a band for 18 years when I was like, triggered from Only Fools and Horses, changing the brushes, changing the handles, you know, 17 times and then saying that I've got the same brim and it's not the same broom. It's probably about four different rooms I had over the years. So, yeah. So, yeah, first of all, if you want, if you're okay, comfortable talking about it. Is that okay? [00:14:32] Speaker A: What it is is that I partied company with inspiral carpets in 2011. That was quite acrimonious. And I mean, there's various disagreements about it. I mean, they said I left, I said they sacked me. But anyway, let's, let's, let's not dwell on that. But I think the situation is I haven't played with the band for 18 years. I haven't played. The last time I played with them was at Manchester Academy in 2008. Now we've been all around every single north, south, east and west with sort of every emotion you can imagine, you know, like, you know, I think they're thoroughly sick of me and I think I'm thoroughly sick of them, but I'm not. I mean, if that's stirring up trouble, then I'm stirring up. But the thing is that they've sort of toured successfully with Stephen Holt, who was the singer they had before me, who left in 988. And I enjoyed really all the commercial success with the band that's in all of the hits, you know, like from 989 onwards. All the singles we did like, first. I mean, the first single we did was we re released Chain Surfing, which Steve sang on. Then we did Joe. Then we did find out why we did Move and then we did this Hat Feels Sorry Because It's Worth going Through. She Comes in the Fall. Then we did Biggest Mountain. Then we did Caravan. Then we did Dragging Me Down. It's Worth just going through the songs. And then we did Two Worlds Collide and then we did Sam five and we did I Want you. So I sang on all the 4ME release records. We went on hiatus for eight years. We got back together in 2002 and we toured 2002, 2, 2005, 2007 and 2008. And then the band went on hiatus again. And then we all fell out in 2011, which I don't really want to go into, but we did fall out. And what's happened is that Stephen's come back and they've been quite successful with Stephen. But the thing that is kind of. Well, there were two things that, from my point of view, from my selfish Tom Hingley point of view, is that they. Because they were thoroughly sick of me, they then went on this thing where they tried to redact my involvement in the band. So, for example, in 2012 we issued our first album as an extended 12 inch album on CD. They adapted me from all the sleeve notes, you know, and this, you know, and this is an album that, you know, I. Well, I probably wrote three or four. [00:16:47] Speaker B: There's no mention of you on the album. [00:16:50] Speaker A: There's no mention of me in the sleeve notes, really. So, I mean. And so basically I went to the guy who makes my CDs and I made my own sleeve notes look like their sleeve notes and I sold about 200 copies of this album. I inserted my own sleeve notes into them. But anyway, so that went on and then what sort of consistently happened happened. And it's not necessarily. It's not necessarily entirely Inspiral's fault, but the business affairs people just keep on using legacy videos with me in them or legacy recordings with me in them. Now, relations with us weren't very good. There was a bit of a fallout as well in 2014 because the band gave it all. Sounds very petty. It always is for band. So I'm, you know, I'm not dismissing my own contribution to the pettiness of this, you know. You know, I'm not making out that I've always been right about everything, you [00:17:38] Speaker B: know, and no, I'm here for the pettiness. And I'm also impressed by the memory. [00:17:43] Speaker A: I've got my tiny little handbag here, but. But it. But it's like, in 2014, they gave away some T shirts to, like, the biggest, you know, to the most responsive fans, you know. And like someone in inspirals. They blagged my signature, my autograph on this T shirt, which I've got to say, I found quite annoying, really, because what was the psychology behind doing that? On one level, it's a joke. I understand it's a joke. But secondly. So you blag my signature on a T shirt. So it's a joke. I get that. It was Graham. He did it, you know, and second. But then, like, why black my name on a T shirt? Is that because they want to annoy me? But is it because they don't really want to? They're playing with the idea that I'm no longer in the band and they're being successful and they don't care. But there's a broader point about that, Mark. And so I had a bit of a row with them on Facebook about it, and particularly with Martin, he's the bass player. He said, well, you always got something to complain about. And I said, no, Martin. I said, if you want to take the piss out of me, that's fine, but don't involve our fans in it, because they're not your fans and they're not my fans. You still there, Mark? I can't see. [00:18:50] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah. [00:18:51] Speaker A: They're not my fans and they're not your fans and our fans. So if you're using our fans, have a go at me. I don't think that's all right. And I've got to be honest, I don't think there is an answer to that. I don't think that is all right, you know. So anyway, I did a band. I started doing a tribute band called the Car Pets, spelled K A R, P, T S. Because I thought, well, kind of trying to mock me. And so, like, maybe they do a bit of mockery back, you know, which they, I've got to say, they didn't like at all. But the thing is, you shouldn't really give it out if you can't take it, really. That's the kind of rule of mockery in it, really. So we. We toured around the place. Now, the next thing, which is a really serious thing, all the stuff I've said is kind of does. Well, it does matter. It doesn't matter. But, you know, Craig obviously passed away in 2016, the drummer, which was very serious, you know, he took his own life and, like, what a terrible, terrible thing to happen. So. So they then insp. Couldn't really tour and they don't, you know, they've done gigs in South America, they've done gigs in Greece and they've done a load of tours and it'll be quite successful. And so they couldn't. So we, we with my band, we went on touring from sort of 2016 pretty much until 2022. Now during the lockdown, I took part in some Tim Burgess tweet alongs where they played all our albums, the listening parties and Twitter. Yeah. And the relationship between us hadn't been very good. But the thing is, I agreed to do it. I. You know, although the relationship with them is strained and complicated, I do still love them, even if they find me completely bloody maddening, you know, and I'm sure there's some affection for me even though. Anyway, you know, so I did it because. Not really for the band, I did it because I thought there might be some people in the audience out there who were struggling in the lockdown. I thought some people might kill themselves or something, you know, taking the lesson of what happened to Craig Gill or whatever, you know. So I took part in it because I thought it was for the greater good and everyone was quite generous and nice to one another. Another. So then what happened in 2022 so things got a little bit better and I'm not going to go into all the whys and wherefores. So in 2022 I was on holiday in Greece and I got like an email from Sean who used to work at Mute and he now works his freelance and he works for bmg, I think it's saying. Inspirals are re releasing this complete singles compilation. And I was, to be honest, all of the color drained out my face and all the relaxation it had being on holiday drained out of me and I got completely. I didn't have a breakdown, but I saw a panic attack really and I just got really ill. The nails also went funny from that moment onwards. So basically I got sent this email saying they're doing this, I don't know, 35 track to vinyl record. The first thing is no one in the band actually told me about it, which I think is a little bit odd really. So there were like 35 tracks on it. There was a remix by the Go team of the Sat Feels and there were the four singles they did on their eponymous album that came out in 2000 and I'm gonna say it came out in 2013 or 2014. So they sent me the track listing. So I wrote back to Sean, I said, look, the first Side of the vinyl has got two. It's got two classic songs by Stephen Holsing on it. It's got Keep circle around off the plane crash EP and it's got Butterfly off Train Surfing. Then it's got four songs of me sing on it. It's got Joe, it's got Find out why. It's got Move. It's got the sat feels the last side of the vinyl, it's got. Got the last two songs I sang Within Spirals. It's got. It's got I want you in uniform. Then it's got the four singles they did after I left. So I said to Sean, just put all the stuff with Steve singing on one side of the vinyl, it's own sleeve notes. So he gets his own. I mean, so he gets the respect that he deserves as a singer and just put all the stuff we sing on the other side. So it's not Sean's fault, you know. So he wrote back to me and said the band and the label don't want to do that. That. So it's like, okay, all right then. So there's 35 tracks on this album. I sang on 27 of them. I wrote some of them. I helped manage the band through a lot of them. And I. So I wrote back to Sean, I said, well, good luck with it, but I'm not going to promote this record because I don't like the singles they did after I left. I'm sorry, I'm not prepared to even pretend for a nanosecond that I do. And I said, I want to be paid for it, but I'm not going to promote it. And so that put everything on a bad. A bad sort of, you know, put it in. It's in a bad thing. So then they started teasing that they were touring again because they got their new job with Kev, because obviously they couldn't tour for years because Craig passed away and because of the terrible. The terrible stuff that that caused to all of them, you know. So anyway, so. So they started teasing that they were touring again at the end of 2022. And what they've repeatedly done since they got back together in 2012 after I left is they've never told the audience who was in the lineup of the band, which I think is not right, really, because obviously a lot of people thought I might have been involved and I kind of got inundated with not that many, probably 60 messages on this. Is this. This is how it affects me, Mark. I mean, I don't know how it Affects them. I can only talk about how it affects me. Right. [00:23:58] Speaker B: I think that basically the assumption was because of everything that's happened and the fact that you were in the, the. The listening party and it was kind of like a greatest hits coming back together and then the. And it's your image that's been used in the promotional material. [00:24:15] Speaker A: Well, anyway, so I wrote to the band and I said, all the band, including Stephen, you know, because I'd had some involvement in writing some sleeve notes for the record, because although I wasn't happy with the record, I'm not going to cut my nose off to the spike to not write some sleeve notes, you know. So I wrote to him, I said, look, what are you doing? I won't rain on your parade I won't tell people what you're doing. Could you tell me what you're doing? So they didn't tell me what they were doing at all. So then on the day that the tickets went on sale in November 2022, I get an email from Clint saying Martin isn't touring because of personal reasons. Would I like to come on stage in Manchester and sing two songs in the encore? It's like what? I tell you what, I could come on in between the support band and them and I could sell ice creams if you want. Have a little thing that comes to utterly ridiculous. That is ridiculous. If you don't believe me, I'll send you the email, I'll show you it. So I left it about two hours and I said, no, thanks. So then they did that tour, right? Then they did a tour of Australia, New Zealand, where the promoter basically on the point, sorry, I haven't answered your question, mark. [00:25:20] Speaker B: But you just tell the story. You just tell the story. [00:25:23] Speaker A: Yeah. So they, they, they. The promoter who promoted him in New Zealand and Australia, on the place where you bought the tickets for the tour, put up five videos of the classic lineup of the band. That's Craig Gill, Clint Boone, Graham Lambert, Martin Walsh and me. All five of them were frozen on a picture of my face. Right. Which would imply that I was involved in the gigs. This may be the problem of the promoter in Australia, New Zealand. So my wife text Clint and she said, the way that this gig is being promoted by the promoter in Australia, New Zealand is very misleading. Can you change it? He didn't reply to us. They didn't change it. I wrote to the music company in Australia and New Zealand. I said, the biography doesn't make it clear who's in the band. And the way you've presented it does not make it clear who's in the band. I probably got 30 messages from people across Australia, New Zealand, who bought tickets for this tour and had to tell them that I wasn't involved in the tour. And they said, what do you mean you're not involved in the tour? You're in the promo, you're in the biography. In the Spiral's own Facebook page, they said that Stephen was singing. So there was a difference between their website and what the point sale was saying, which, I'm sorry, suggests a strategy to me, I'm afraid. So I put a tweet up on my. On my Twitter line saying, I just want to make it clear that I'm not involved in this. These gigs in Australia, and I hope they go well. But I think it's been. I think it's very curious the way it's being promoted and I want people to know I'm not involved in them. Now, clearly, this made Graham really, really annoyed because about two months later I got an email from him threatening me legally, because someone in a tiny little bar in Lee, which is actually kind of been helped by the music venue trust, actually, because they said in a Facebook post that I was the front man of Inspiral Carpets, right? So then 18 months of legal stuff then got involved because, actually, according to the partnership agreement we have in 1990, they're not allowed to use the name unless there's three people in the band who were in the partnership agreement in 1990. Now, I'm not petty enough to make fuss about that, but if the guitarist out of the band sends me a legal letter saying that they're going to get their. Their. Their lawyer to contact the venue of a tiny little venue, which I think we're all on the side of tiny little venues, aren't we? Because someone said in a Facebook post that I'm the front. I'm the, you know, I'm the front man of Inspiral Carpets. They didn't even have the right to use the name because Martin wasn't playing with them. Do you see where I'm going? So I got a lawyer, we wrote to him and said, you haven't got the right to use the name. So in 18 months, back and forth went on. Eventually I had a meeting with Graham and Clint in the summer of 2023, where they bollocks me for 20 minutes saying, you sent a tweet saying the band had split up. And I took it all and I accepted it all. Me in a room with Graham and Clint and two lawyers wasn't the easiest conversation I've ever had. We went for 25 minutes and I said to her and Clinton, I said, while it might be giving you some closure, and yeah, I did send a tweet saying the band is put up in 2011. You sacked me. If you continue down this line, I'll start telling you why I sent a tweet saying the band is put up. And I said, you're not going to like it if I do, because so far you've been telling me off. I said, if we go any further with this discussion, I'm going to start telling you why you sent that, why I sent that tweet and you're not going to like it. It. So we can do is talk about how to sort it out or we can go on talking about this. It's entirely up to you. So anyway, so that didn't lead to anything. So then we had another to and forth between all the solicitors. So then at the end of the year of 2024, they said, let's do a mediation. So I went to their office with my wife, my manager, mediator. They had two lawyers. There were four of them there, Steve and Clinton, Martin and Graham. I sat in their lawyer's office and it wasn't easy for them either. So I'm not saying that this was all that this has been easy for them. So basically, after 11 and a half hours, cost me a couple of thousand pounds, we came to an agreement where they would pay me some money for paying me for T shirts, which they haven't done for 15 years, which they have to do, they had to pay me some money for basically. Maybe it wasn't their fault, but someone implied that I was in this tour in Australia, New Zealand, which I wasn't. And because they operated without there being enough members of people in the band to operate right now, after 11 and a half hours, one of the bat two of the band signed the agreement and one of them walked out. So every time I do a gig anywhere, everyone tells me I need to sort out this problem between me and Inspiral Carpus. What more can I do than spend a couple of thousand pounds, eleven and a half hours in a lawyer's office, battering it all out. It wasn't with them. We were in different rooms. It's probably like what's going on in between on a much bigger, more worrying scale, it's what is going on between Iran and America. I can't do anything more than that. So. So, so one of Them walked out, right? So then about three weeks later, my lawyer wrote to them and said, right, what do you want to agree to? So their lawyer came back and said, we'll pay this paltry amount of money. You can walk away from any involvement you've ever had in the band. Absolute lunacy, right? This is all going on on the backdrop of, oh, you know, Tom's a problem, he's a nightmare. He's bitter, he's selfish. You will never meet. I don't know how well you know me, Mark. You will never meet anyone in life. I started off playing music in the punk years, right? You'll never meet anyone who's more straightforward, who sticks to what they're asked to do. I'm not beyond criticism as a singer. I used to sing in church. I will, I. I will sing anywhere. I'll do anything. If you put me in the situation where I'm difficult, that's because I haven't been treated properly, right? I've got loads of friends in the industry. I've got loads of promoter friends, loads of punter friends. I occasionally get things wrong sometimes I have a bit of a tantrum. I'm a human being, but generally speaking, I'm generally respected in the music industry quite well. So anyway, so at that meeting. So anyway, so that. So that was off. And this was a year ago, so then last year I had a manager and the manager said to me, like, don't ruffle any feathers, just keep it going. So one thing I have said, so I'm not telling the story very well, when we had the meeting in August 2000, and I guess it was 24 with Graham and Clinton, me, I said to him, you need to sort your merchandise out and you need to get a manager, right? Which is. Those two comments aren't horrible, you know, they're not horrible. So anyway, so now they're being managed by Alan McGee and a guy called Kevin Fitzgerald, who managed Gene and they also managed the Lighthouse family and stuff like that. And, you know, obviously McGee and. And Kevin's ace, you know, but, like, what's happened recently is a load of gigs have gone on sale, like the support that they're doing with the Wonder stuff, and they're playing Guild Festival and they're playing at. At the why Not Festival. And all these festivals are using. They're using visuals and audio and videos of me, right? They don't have the right to use them under. Under our partnership agreement, which is in 1990, they've got the right to use my intellectual property Rights. So pictures of me, audio of me, video of me to sell records. They don't have the right to promote gigs with it. Right? So we've been through this round and round it. So Graham threatened me legally, because someone said I was the front man of Inspiral Carpets. But they want to use my voice, my skills, my image, my video, all that stuff when they're doing some festival somewhere, you know, they're not doing these gigs to feed starving children in Africa, are they? They're doing these gigs for their career and to make money. So, like, if you want to use audio, visual content of me, you've got three choices. You can ask me a sing, in which case you're gonna have to pay me the same amount of money that you're getting paid. Right. Or you can ask me very nicely if you can use my ip. Well, that's not happened because they treat me incredibly badly over the years. Or you can pay me for doing it. Those are the three options you can do. But what you can't do is pretend I wasn't in the band, use my images so that other people can put tools on sale that are not representative of the offer of what the band is. But what you can't do is continuously go on doing this. So I went on there yesterday and I said, it's taken a long time to get to this point of the. The thing which is really where we started, Mark. There's now only two members of the band who were in the band in 1990, because Stephen Holt wasn't in the band in 1990 when we drew out the partnership agreement. There's Martin and Clint. Stephen wasn't in the band in 1990. They've got a new drummer called Kev and Clint's son is going to be playing guitar. There are not three members in the band. Right. So, of course, as the band shifts further away from what it was in its classic era, the more it's going to have to rely on the archive of the stuff that isn't there. And that's. That's the issue, you know, [00:35:15] Speaker B: that's a lot to take in. [00:35:17] Speaker A: Yeah. I probably shouldn't have talked about any of it, but that's where we're at. And then you've got all these fans who've drunk all the Kool Aid. You've got all these fans who've drunk all the Kool Aid. Right. It's, oh, Tom's bitter. When I left that band. Graham did an interview with John Rob that came out the day after they sat Me out that band. Graham said Tom is so fat he can't do more than one gig. Then he has to not do another gig. I'd done since 2008. Between 2008 and 2011 of that interview coming out, I'd probably done 500 gigs. Graham hadn't done any gigs in three years. And do you know what? I've had a decent lawyer. I would have sued John Robin him for libel because it was actually a professional libel. If you want to look at it it it's still up on the net. Go and have a look at it. Go and have a look for John. [00:36:08] Speaker B: Rob, can you get this? Could the podcast or get sued for label? Am I in danger? [00:36:14] Speaker A: No, because no one's asked about it. I'm saying I could have done. I'm not saying I did. You know. So then a year later, Graham doesn't Clinton interview with the same source and he just said I that Tom has no soul. And then people turn around to me and say, I'm bitter, I'm bitter. You've been in a band of people for years and sold millions of records and someone in it says you have no soul. You've been serious. And that's supposed to be okay? I tell you what, you better not say anything about that in the future because if he does, he'll get it back three times. Because I spent a lot of time with Clint and if he wants to make comments like that he may get. For example, people are talking to me about being, you know, being fake. Clint doesn't even use a file fees. He's got two nor two synths. He hides behind a piece of wood with far fees are written on it. I think that's a little bit metaphorical for what's going on with the band really, to be honest. [00:37:13] Speaker B: And like you said, it doesn't matter [00:37:15] Speaker A: what keyboard couldn't use this, but it matters to him. Ridiculous that I, I started bands, I started off in punk bands in 1976, you know, when I was 11 years old being through a bassam, you know, before my balls dropped or whatever. For me, that's not what music is about music is about. It's about, you know, I, I, I, I, I'll tell you one last, I'll tell you one more story and then I'm gonna have to go in a bit. But so anyway, so I understand there's a commercial need to market in spiral carpets. I get that. I understand that 100%. But like in2022 they headlined Shine Good on them. I you Know. Good. I'm glad they headlined it. When they sell stuff out, it makes me proud. I don't have a problem with them playing. Do you understand what I'm saying, Mark? I don't have a problem with them playing. Right. So in 2024, the Shine on people were doing a new product, because I'm going to use that word. They did a new night in. In. In. It's a seaside town. They usually do stuff in Minehead and it was in. In somewhere else. You'll have to. You'll have to. You'll have to look where Dine on do these. These big events. It's held in March every year. They've just done the second one and you don't know where it is, do you, Mark? Anyway, though, I do. [00:38:39] Speaker B: It's in. I know it's in Butlands, but I think it's a fort Butlands. It's Main Head. Does that sound right? [00:38:44] Speaker A: No, they do on somewhere else. Yeah. Yeah. So a year before they did the. The first one in Skegness, that was last year, they took a video of and Spirals headlining at shine on in 2000. I'm gonna say it was 2023. Good on them. Great. But what the video director did was he cut it to the audio of me singing on Saturn 5. So there's Steve singing his heart out when he was within Spirals at Minehead. Good on him. So what they did was they grabbed it and they edited it to fill it in with my singing. So about eight minutes after this went up, a fan told me. So I rang up Stephen, he rung sign on and said, you'll have to take that down. [00:39:28] Speaker B: Sorry, I think I lost that. So he's performing the song and they've swapped. [00:39:32] Speaker A: They filmed them and so they filmed them in 2022 when they were filming. They took the video of it. No, I didn't explain it well. And they cut it. [00:39:40] Speaker B: Clarify that. So, yes. [00:39:42] Speaker A: So they cut it to the single that I sang on. So I rang him up and I said, you'll have to take that down. They said, we applied for a lip sync license. I said, I haven't agreed to it. I. I have not agreed to this. So they put me onto their video director. So the video director said to me, well, I used to be in a band in London where I played bass in a. In a. In a. In a. In pubs. And I got sacked. I said, stop there, mate. You're in some band no one's ever heard of, Right. I was in a massive band that Sold loads of records going all around the world. Don't start telling me that you have some understanding for how I feel about this. I said, if you'd have. From the Jam on, would you put Paul Wellers voice up against me? [00:40:20] Speaker B: No. [00:40:20] Speaker A: No. If you have the Stranglers on, would you put Hugh Cornwall's voice out there? No. So why did he put my voice up with a video that is not representative of the band? So now I've fallen out with the shine on people. I fall out with the shine on people because they did something wrong. Normally you fall out with people because you've done something wrong. So I'm now being painted in the music industry as being a pain in the ass. Do you know why I'm a pain in the ass? Because I won't put up with people messing me around. And if the penalty of being. I'm very successful in the music industry in the very small little niche way that I operate. I'm not Elvis, not Mick Jagger, you know, I'm not Bobby Gillespie. I just operate in a really small way. But if people take your image and they take your voice and they take your performance and they use it to put it with stuff that you are not. Not related to. First thing is they can't do that without your permission. Secondly, when you've asked them privately not to do that over and over again, you're only left with the choice to talk about it publicly then, aren't you? If they won't do it privately, then you have to do it publicly, as far as I can see. Secondly, by using my image in a way that is not being given permission, it gives some people in the audience impression that I'm going to be at the gig. Thirdly, it makes it harder for me to get work. So. So which part of that is bitter? [00:41:46] Speaker B: And how. How does. How did they react to the cap, as you mentioned earlier on that they weren't best pleased with it. But do you. Can you use the. Like the. The hats from back in the day or the festivals that you play? Are you allowed or. What's the situation there? [00:42:05] Speaker A: We never ever said we were in spiral carpets, to be honest. For the first year we wore wigs. We never said that we were in spiral carpets. If songs are published, anyone can play them. That's what publishing deal is. Anyone can play them. We never said that we were in spiral carpets. And we never used. We. We never used their videos, we never used their photos. [00:42:30] Speaker B: A festival promoter booked you, for example. How would they. Would they have to skip around they [00:42:36] Speaker A: built me today, they'd call me Tom Hingley. And banned, I mean carpets was kr. Hyphen pts. There's no inspirals in the front of it. Yeah, no one thinks it's inspiral carpets. We never tried to save rooms. But I can't be, I couldn't be, you know, I'm saying. So, I mean, I'm sure they feel entirely differently about all of it, but, but they need to stop using my IP to promote their gigs because their gigs are nothing like the gigs that we did. And if they want to use my ip, they should have treated me differently, I'm afraid, because, because I just won't be treated in that way. [00:43:11] Speaker B: And it's, it's a shame obviously, because you mentioned earlier on about the fans and obviously the, because fans are put in a position where they love the band. They love you. It's like when a couple that you really like, both of them, they break up and you, you want both to do well, you want to be friends with both. Do you see there being any resolution here? [00:43:35] Speaker A: Well, there's no gonna be, gonna be no resolution privately because, because we couldn't resolve it, you know, and you know, I understand, I understand the difficulties it would go there are on both sides, but I'm not going to attend another mediation. I mean, I don't think they're going to be offering one after this interview, are they? But I, I, I'm not going to be attending another mediation. No. Because I'd have something better to do like taking the rubbish to the dump or something. I never, I, I don't have the energy in my body to do that ever again, you know, and they could have, they could always have picked up the phone, you know. They could always have picked up the phone. You know, I'm proud of what I did with that band. I don't hate them, but I won't, I simply will not be treated in that way. I'm afraid the only people I put up would treat me that way are my wife and my kids. [00:44:27] Speaker B: The band does family though, I suppose, like you said, that he's got back for the, the listening party. The, the time was right. It felt like the right thing to do. So do you. With an apology, with. Is there any chance of mediation? You're saying that you would never go a mediation again? [00:44:44] Speaker A: No, because I'd have to get a lawyer like that. Eleven and a half hours. It cost me three and a half grand, that eleven and a half hours. No, the thing is, there's a bedrock under all this. They don't agree about what they're doing either. I became the grist of a disagreement between Graham and Clint. I don't know why it is. It's for personal issues, you know, and I'm sure, I hope there's nothing bad going on. I did send a text to Graham about six weeks ago because he said he wasn't playing with the band. I said, I hope you're okay because despite all these disagreements, I'm not actually a nasty person, you know, And I. I don't think Graham and Clinton agree about. I don't think Graham and Clinton agree about what they're doing. I think I got caught up in all that, you know, I mean, like there was a whole row after we didn't tour for three years where they tried to shut Martin out of the band. I stopped them from chucking mine out of the band. I've spoken to mine a little bit over the last five years. I told him that, that and you know, I mean, it's in my book. I wrote a book called Carpet Burns that goes into it all. And I said, you know, they tried to sat you out the band. And Martin, I don't know why, maybe he read the book. I can't believe he didn't read the book. But it was like, so mine. They. They found someone to replace him. I stopped them so I can mine out the band. So seeing fans saying to me, oh, like you're dead bitter and you're just concerned about yourself, it isn't true. It's not true. That is simply not true. It was a difficult situation because they were a band that were going before I was. They're from the north, you know, I'm a bit of a posh boy from the south. All of that's true. But. But I don't think it was okay. I don't think. I don't think it was okay how I was treated. I don't think they were really all right about Stephen when he wasn't in the band either. They weren't very nice about him for the 23 year period he was out of the band. I don't really think I joined in with him. It really, to be honest, you know, and that's. That's the sort of thing that's sad is that it's become a kind of. [00:46:47] Speaker B: Did you even have a relationship or did you just kind of like ships in an age? [00:46:50] Speaker A: Not really because I did. I. I did three gigs with them. One at Holadelphy, one at I'm gonna say it was UCL and one somewhere else. And I mean, I did meet Stephen at a Tinder Tinder Sticks gig about three years ago, and I went up and spoke to him because I don't. I don't have any. I don't particularly have any antipathy towards him and I've walked a few miles in his shoes, but I've no idea why he would put. I mean, I'm just saying as. As an artist and a singer. I'm just saying I don't understand why he would have been okay with Shine on cutting him singing his mouth open and close it to me singing. I wouldn't. I mean, I'm not. I'm not criticizing Stephen. I'm talking about myself. [00:47:31] Speaker B: Yeah, no, I don't know. I understand what you mean is if you. If someone used a video of you singing and they replaced with Question Voice with someone else, that if someone said [00:47:40] Speaker A: to me, I'm not criticizing Stephen, I'm making a point about my worldview. [00:47:43] Speaker B: Yes. No, I understand. [00:47:44] Speaker A: If someone said to me. Someone said to me, we're going to shoot you in the head unless we can put someone else's voice up against you. They'd have to shoot me in the head because I would not agree to it as an artist. I wouldn't agree to it as an artist. And this is the problem with Inspiral Carpets because, you know, like, there were a couple of super fans and after I got dumped out the band, they told a load of people that. That all the stuff on our first album had been sung by. By. By Stephen. It's not true, you know, like, I think he did an early version of she Comes in the Fall. He did Commercial Rain. It was nothing like the version we did. He did Joe. When they did Joe, it was very like, it's a great song. Clint wrote it. It's very like New Face and Hell by the Fool. When I came in, I shouted Joe at the beginning of it. I anticipated the vocals, so the vocals came in at the beginning of the bar. So along with Craig, it became more of a sort of funky drummer break beat thing. It's not the same song. There were little narration bits that Craig used to do a bit like Marky Smith in between the verses. On the original version of Joe, the version I did was. It's nothing like the one that they did receive. Move. I think they had a go at doing it. The chorus had a move. I ripped off. I ripped off a bit of the singing from Philip Nelson and Move Closer. There's no way that that was in the band. When Steve was in the band, Sackville wasn't written. Find out why. Well, it's not on the album, but, you know, I wrote it, you know, so like after I got chucked out the band, there was all this people reimagining what had actually happened for the first year that I was in that band. And that's very hurtful. You know, this is how it feels. Clint wrote the song, but I was a bit of amused for Clint because I was probably. It's very smart, Clint, but I was probably in some ways slightly more world aware than him, you know, when I was 18, I went and bust on down in Berlin for four months. Berlin is the only city I've missed two outward flights from by being drunk or asleep. So I've been around the world a little bit more, you know, and me and my ex wife, we lived in a warehouse above Sackville street and Clint came and taught me how to sing the songs on his pedal organ that ended up being thrown into that pond or the South Fields video. And that's where Clint saw the stuff that he wrote Satville about. Because I lived in this loft apartment in the middle of town. That's pretty bohemian, really, compared to what a lot of the rest of them were doing. So what I'm saying is he wrote the Satfields. It's a great song, but he wrote it partly for me to sing. There's no way that Noel auditioned to me in the band. There's no way that Noel or Steve would have sung a song in Nightingale 89. That when. This is how it feels to be lonely and this is how it feels to be small. This is how it feels when you were doing stuff. [00:50:31] Speaker B: Are you talking about Gallagher here? [00:50:32] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, but I'm saying he auditioned. He didn't get into that. But Clint wouldn't have written a song that went, this is how it feels to be lonely. This is how it feels to be small. This is how it feels when your word means nothing at all. Because it would have been seen to being too vulnerable from a male point of view. So the sort of aspect in most people in 1989, if we were male, would be, oh, that's a bit gay, isn't it? And they wouldn't have sung it. So that song would not have existed had I not been in that band and Clint had been expanding the vision of what he did. So to come back years after and to be told, oh, you just sat there and you just sang what you. What was Written and you sang all the stuff before. I've been in bands since 1976. You know, it took me 13 years to get into a band that had a deal and this idea that I was just. Oh, yeah, he just tried join this band. We'd done appeal session with the band I was in before Too Much Texas. We supported New Order at the Hacienda. We'd supported the House of Love at the Boardwalk. We supported the Beloved at the House of Love at the. At the Boardwalk. We supported the Pastels at the Boardwalk. Boardwalk. We did a gig in the Rock Garden, I think probably with Damon Auburn in some band that was before Seymour. So people can't turn around to me and say, well, I just joined this band and then it's just not true. And I'm sorry if the fans wanna pretend that's true. You know, I worked in the Hacienda for two years, you know, when all the ball. When all the Baldricks were there and stuff. So for people to turn around and say, oh, you're just some bloke who didn't know what they're doing. I'm sorry, it simply isn't true. And part of the problem when I was in the band was I was too in assertive. And I didn't actually assert myself enough. And I'm now paying for that now because people just see think of me as being some agile chunk that was swept up with the band. It's not true. Simply, it's not true. And if that isn't convenient and it doesn't fit in with people's little tunnel way that they say, see things, that's fine, but it doesn't make me bitter, it doesn't make me selfish and it doesn't make me wrong as far as I'm concerned. [00:52:32] Speaker B: Very well. Do you have time for questions or. [00:52:36] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. It can't be long though. Yeah, yeah, yeah. [00:52:39] Speaker B: Okay, we'll go. Okay. If you've got any questions, now's the time. Shannon, he says. I'm friends with both, but I love Tom Moore. [00:52:49] Speaker A: Well, I can't blame you for that. [00:52:53] Speaker B: Cliff says, stand by your principles, Tom. [00:52:56] Speaker A: I'm sure they feel the same though. Of course. [00:53:00] Speaker B: And Sarah Pierce is in the house. Could listen to Tom all day. Hello, Jigsaw Tiger. And Too Much Texas's class. I've got to go back to the. The. The. What you're saying about the. The track listing. If they had agreed to put all your songs in one side and Stevens on the other, do you think things would have been different? [00:53:29] Speaker A: Yeah. I think they should have told me the record was coming out in the first place. I think they should have told me the record was coming out. Right. I'm sorry that I've. After they put their record out, I'm going to say it was in 2014. It's taken me 12 years to say I don't like the records that they did. You know. You know, and it's just, you know, and I'm sorry about that. But, yes, I. I would have got involved with that record. But the fact of the matter is, is that I didn't like the way it was put together. I thought the remix by the Go Team was absolutely dreadful. And the idea that someone got paid money for that crap. They didn't. When I say they didn't. It doesn't necessarily have to be in Spiral Carpets. The people were put in the record together. Didn't tell me that there was a remix being done. How can you do a remix of a band. Band's biggest single without telling the person who sang on it? So there's a remix going. This isn't like some pop band. It isn't like Day City Rollers. This is nonsense. It's ridiculous. Do you know what? Clint is a talented person. He's an intelligent person. Graham is a talented person. Craig was a talented person. Martin is a talented person. I'm a talented person. And you know what comes with being people? Being talented people? It makes them a pain in the ass. For every skill you have and every ability you have that sets you apart from other people, that makes you exceptional. The flip side of that is that you're a pain in the ass. So I'm not going to take a monopoly on being a bigger pain in the ass than anyone else, because with talent comes being a pain in the ass. [00:55:20] Speaker B: And you would say that everyone's equally a pain in the ass. [00:55:24] Speaker A: No, not necessarily. I mean. I mean, not necessarily. I mean, I think that. I think the tragedy of that band is where you get good music. Look at Liam and Noel or whatever. Where you get good music is tension in bands. And I think, you know, I think, you know, they've. In spirals. They've had their successes without me, you know, I think that. I think the video for Spitfire is great. I don't like the song. You know, they've had their successes, you know, and they're. They're existing very successfully. I don't mean this in a cynical way. I mean, in a nice way, they're succeeding very well in the music industry of today. Or whatever. But they kind of need to stand. [00:56:08] Speaker B: It's not an easy thing to do, [00:56:09] Speaker A: but they need to stop using my IP to do it. It's that simple. Because, you know, I mean, like. Like the. They didn't do it, but the. You know, I contacted why. Why Not Festival and I explained to them that they don't. The. The band don't have the right to use my image and this lot. Do you know what? They took it down. They took it down after I wrote to them, they apologized and they took it down. And so you can't expect everyone. [00:56:37] Speaker B: Yeah. So that. Yeah, that could. That is definitely a wicked. You know, I've booked for festivals before as well. Honestly, if you're promoting a bad. And it could be a complete oversight and they'll not be aware of the internal politics and they're just. They've. Somebody just decided to. To share one of the. The classic hits and. And obviously you were on a lot of them. A lot. Although the majority even. So I've got some. A few more comments. I know you've not got long. [00:57:03] Speaker A: We've got. [00:57:03] Speaker B: When are you playing Sheffield next? Says John Taylor Gibson. [00:57:08] Speaker A: Sheffield, not easy to come by. I mean, I wrote to a place called Cafe 9 and they never got back to me. So, I mean, I'll just go through some gigs. I am actually doing Glasgow coming up soon. [00:57:19] Speaker B: May 18th. King Touch. [00:57:21] Speaker A: Yeah, I think it might be May 11th. Actually, check that date. May 11th. At King Touch. I'm playing Bannerman's in Edinburgh on April 24th. I'm playing in the Neptune Bar, which is in. Isn't in Sheffield, but it's in. It's in Donny, So it's not too far away way from Sheffield. This Friday, Saturday we're playing down in Banbury, a place called the Apothecary. And there's a support band. There's a punk support band called Brian and the Onions. You want to look out for them. They've got a single out called Small Boats, which is. It's talking about Small Boats. I'll let you decide whether it's pro reform or anti reform. But they're supporting us there. Yeah, I've got some band gigs coming up. We've got a band gig coming up in Crew on the May. Late May. May bank holiday, Saturday. That's the 23rd of May. That's in crew. Crew Live. We're playing thereon. [00:58:22] Speaker B: Is in Chesterfield, not Doncaster. [00:58:23] Speaker A: We've got. Oh, God, I'm terrible. All these, you know. So glad. I'm afraid the World is my A memoir because I just. I have dyslexia. I think I may all also have adhd, but I also have B O rng and I'm always sometimes a bit of a twat, if you know what I'm saying. Yes, there's a lot of gigs if you want to find them go to tomhingly.co.uk or have a look at any of my. So I'm gonna have to reverse up because there's a dust truck that's reversing up and it's getting a little bit near. If this was my demise that was recorded on your program, well that would end up on have you been framed or whatever. It might even end up on a future re release of Inspiral Carpets hits. Who knows. Yeah, so yeah, so there's a load of gigs. I mean I should probably be able to tell you all the rest of them. We've got. I mean we're doing a festival. I'm doing a festival in Leon Sea which is near Southend. We're doing. I'm doing a little gig actually in Aston on the line for a left wing homeless charity called we shall Overcome. I'm doing that with Attila the Stockbroker. So we're doing a couple of gigs [00:59:30] Speaker B: for this old punk guy, Broker. I think we're bringing them. I think we've been looking from W gig from November so. [00:59:38] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So with any other questions? [00:59:41] Speaker B: Yes, there was one more. We'll do one more question. One question. But Cliff says you were great at Liverpool Experts with Ian Prowse and Anuska. Can't wait to see you in Edinburgh. And you. Shane says it'll be on crime watch. So the question was. There was one more question from Budget. Sorry, Budget Budge Budget. Budget. How do you choose which carpets tracks to sing live along with your solo stuff? Saw you at from recently. [01:00:14] Speaker A: Yeah, I think it's called Froome, I'm afraid. [01:00:20] Speaker B: And I've been. [01:00:20] Speaker A: Well, when in. When you're in Froome, when in I turn into someone out. The Archers is sort of 56 miles away from Southampton because I played on the Isle of Wight in Strings Bar on Thursday. It's sort of not too far. It's not exactly near Glastonbury. It's near Bath, so it's not far from there. It's near Bradford on Avon, which is a very nice place. Yeah. How do I decide what to play? Okay, well I wrote some of the songs so dragging me down I wrote Find out why I wrote I I wrote Weakness so I can play those. I wrote Please Be Cruel, I me and Graham wrote Born Yesterday. I play anything that's easy to play on a guitar. I don't play things of two minute keyboard solos in them because unless I'm gonna strap a gazoo to my face, that's going to be hard to actually reproduce. It's mostly. I've been doing this for 27 years now, you know, I've been kind of solo in one respect or another since 1999. There was a big eclipse of the sun in 1999 in the middle of the afternoon and when it. When it came through, I was in a different place, I think. And I started sort of started doing a lot of solar geeks from that moment onwards. And I've support Ian Brown on the Millennium Z in Millen in the Castlefield Arena. I think there were 20000 people there. I've done a charity gig singing with Larry, Jimmy and Dave out of James. I came on and sang three songs with. With the Blockheads, which I've got to say I've been playing with, rehearsing with James three times. I mean. I mean, obviously look in Spirals. [01:02:02] Speaker B: We had so in the show not long ago when they celebrated the Number One album last year again, wonderful. [01:02:07] Speaker A: But I'm saying obviously there was actually a story. I tell you a positive story. If should give you a positive story about. [01:02:15] Speaker B: Don't give us any toxic positivity. [01:02:18] Speaker A: Yeah, well, I leave that. I'll leave that for my relationships. Anyway, we did, we did. We played at the Apollo. I'm going to say it was in 2005 or maybe it was later. But anyway, Sean Ryder came on, he sang at the end, end. And he did a medley of songs with us. Although I. And Sean's great, obviously he's great. And I supported Black Grape with the the Carpets three years ago and that was great. And they were great, you know, and Kermit's great as well. But anyway, he came on and sang with us at the Apollo and I did say to Graham, I said, get him on at the end because he has terrible stage fright. I said, but once he gets on stage, he won't want to get off stage again. And so he came on and did this. This medley. I kind of lost this. There was a funny story I was gonna tell you, but I've lost the thread. Oh, yeah. So anyway, after the gig, Sean was on one side of the stage and in the dressing room. We were on the other side of the stage in the dressing Room. And by the way, what I'm saying now might not be exactly word for word what was said, but it's the spirit of what was said. And I'll try and say in as neutral voice as possible a couple of, maybe it was Craig, or maybe it was mine, or maybe it was Clint, it was Graham and saying like, oh, God, it was fantastic playing with Shaw Ryder. And I said, what are you on about? He said, what are you on about? You're an amazing band. It was entirely his privilege. Privilege wasn't you playing with Shaw. Privilege was Sean playing with you. So that is the conundrum, that's the paradox, that's the $64,000 slip up. Because, Sean, we may never ever, you know, we may never ever talk again or whatever. Or I might, you know, you know, I might see if I met Graham and B and Q or if I'm, you know, if I met any of them anywhere or whatever. I mean, I can say I'd be all right with them. I don't want my photo taken with them because we, we have, we have issues between us. But I don't, you know, I'm proud of the stuff I did with them. And of course this is all about. Bit sad. But I, I, I do think really that, you know, that and I'm gonna just leave it, honest. I'm being positive. [01:04:28] Speaker B: I'm going to leave it on a slightly negative. [01:04:33] Speaker A: Leave, no, leave it on a slightly negative thing, which is this is if the way the music industry works. Sorry, because that is going a little bit negative. The way it works is that the only way, in some capacity, the only way that they can get bookings is by still harking back to the date of someone they don't even know admit was in the band, then they need to knock it on the head. If they can't actually sell it for what it is in 2026, then they need to knock it on the head. Because I'm doing, I'm writing a love album at the moment called Making Love. We're doing this punk band called Brian and the Onions. You know, you know, it's, I've got, I've got, I'm doing this album with Joe Dudridge out, the traveling band, you know, this, this love album. And, and I've probably, you know, and I know they say in Spinal Tap they put out 11 albums in eight years or something. That's always a bit of a joke. I mean, I'm always working on two or three projects at one time, and I'm not I'm not really. What I'm saying is I think they need to have a look hard look at what they're doing. Because if the way. The way that the. The promoters have to sell them is on the basis of something that they. They are different from, then maybe it's time to do something else. You know, I. Don't you get what I'm saying? I don't mean that in a horrible way. Yeah, I mean I manage myself. Right. I'm not, you know, I've said I'm successful in this. I'm not as successful as could it be though. [01:06:01] Speaker B: Like, for example, the why. The why not thing. I think we can agree that. That that would have maybe just been the festival that's made that mistake. So it might not be the. The. Were they. Were they booked based on the fact that you were going to be there or was. It was a bit more complicated than that. Oh, Tom has gone, but he did mention Brian and the Onions. Hopefully it comes back. If not, this is Brian Onions. You've been shooting it. You call that radio? Thank you to the patrons who make this show possible. Like, and subscribe if you've not been here before. Thanks very much. [01:06:45] Speaker A: Mark. [01:06:46] Speaker B: You are back. You are back. Good. [01:06:47] Speaker A: Yeah, I've got to go because I've got to go and dress up as Jesus Christ and then say I'm a doctor. I always have to do that this time of night because I just think that's easy. I'm trying to work, find out what other great world leaders I could insult before I bring peace to the. To the universe. [01:07:00] Speaker B: Yes. And. And like Donald Trump who threatened to blow up bridges, I think Tom may have done more damage to bridges than Trump did. But yeah, I've cut the interview there because on the live show ended up playing a song by Brian and the Onions. But it's given me copyright problems on YouTube, so I'm a subject. And it'll also give me copyright issues on Spotify and Apple or whatever you podcast your podcast from. But much love to the audio podcast people. I see you are my favorites. Don't bother about YouTube. Ignore YouTube. Just. Just you stay in your audio podcast where you don't comment. You can comment, by the way. You can comment in Spotify now and shout outs to the people that do because I do read the. And also I just realized that we've not had an Apple review in about four years and that's because I used to always say, oh, leave us a little review on the podcast app you're in. I use Pocket Cats Pocket Cats Pocket cast Another thing we've ever had one review on there so if you are able to leave a review then do it just dare because since I've stopped asking people to leave review neighbor these didn't it So I think it helps the algorithm or whatever. So I leave us a review if you can or leave us a comment. If you're on Spotify, make sure you're hitting the follow button wherever you are. And one more plug for the Patreon patreon.com forward/you call that radio. That is how we're able to do all the things that we are. We do. And when I say we I mean me. And I would like to shout to my sponsors Nikant because you call that radio is sponsored by Nikon. Thank you for listening. Episode 11 will be out in the next day or two featuring a chat with Brains McLeod, aka Gavin Bain, who's got an actual movie of his life Directed by James McAvoy out in all cinemas now called California Scheming. So go and watch that movie and come back in a day or two or if you're living in the future, it's probably already and we'll be talking about California Scheming. Thank you for listening. Thank you to Tom. Bye. [01:09:30] Speaker A: You call that radio.