'Ayahuasca in Ayrshire' w/ Colin Hunter

[00:00:10] Speaker A: I was hat over the head where the first E. Cat. When I awoke I felt like shit I should have stayed down But I. [00:00:28] Speaker B: Got up. [00:00:31] Speaker A: And I fell down. [00:00:35] Speaker B: I. [00:00:35] Speaker A: Was torn between myself and the deep But I don't love any however, when I drank from the cup I plead for keys unrelaxed and form but if I show dreams self sown station strapped from the seams if you steal my ghost When I wake I'm scaping town I was torn between myself and the deep But I don't love in me however, when I drank from the cup. [00:01:28] Speaker B: I play for keep. [00:01:34] Speaker A: I'm not done yet I'm just seeing I was torn between myself and the deep But I don't love any however, when I drank from the cup I plead for keeps. [00:02:30] Speaker C: We are live. You're just listening there to Colin Hunter, first aid cat, taken from his new album, King of the Rats. Colin, you probably know Colin Con's been the show many times before. Airshow singer, songwriter, drummer. You may know his band Mellow Party. He's even gained a few international caps playing drums for the Poison Chalice role, that is drummer with the Gyro Babies. Let's get him on the news. Colin Hunter. Hello. [00:03:06] Speaker B: Hello, Mark. You look as if Captain Cook asked you to set your phasers. Taste stunning. [00:03:15] Speaker C: But good. I'm like, good. [00:03:17] Speaker B: You look great, man. [00:03:18] Speaker C: Thank you. Thank you. Well, as you know, I've got. I could do a bit better, maybe, like, look, here we go, a bit of light on this. I've got. I'm doing my best to have the lighting, so I'm using this, a torch for my phone today and it is stunning my eyes, as I can actually see, but it hopefully makes the show look a bit better. So I just. Listening to your album there, that was first aid kit. Tell us about that first. [00:03:45] Speaker B: So, first aid kit. When I was going through a divorce, I was like getting my stuff at my old flat in Shorelands to move it and I was getting this wardrobe and I was like, I'm not that tall. So I was like trying to get stuff up and then I've got a boxing trophy that I had for doing a charity boxing thing that we did years ago with Kevin Dyson and Bruce McIntosh with musicians, fight musicians. And I've. I won it. So I did. Anyway, this boxing trophy fuzz and cracks me in the head. And the irony that I nearly get knocked to be the boxing trophy, like, stuck with me. So when I was in my kind of halfway house before I got my. My new flat, I Was just gonna pen in a lot of lyrics there and that was the first line I got. I was over the head with a first aid kit. [00:04:45] Speaker C: That's good. It's like it reminds me of a bit of band lyric which is choking on a vitamin tablet. So why not, why not say that you get knocked by my boxing trophy? [00:05:00] Speaker B: I don't know. I, I, I don't know. I just quite liked whenever I was. [00:05:05] Speaker C: Thinking it does work better. It does work better. And also I think you've you running the risk of just basically making people hang. He's just wrote this song so he could boast about winning a boxing but. [00:05:16] Speaker B: As, as well as that like I had, you know, I was self medicating and up with alcohol for years and years and years and to me that was my medication that was like my first aid kit, you know what I mean? And it was like the thing, the thing that I was using to get me through the day was the thing that was stopping me to possibly not waking up the next day. You know what I mean? So that's why I, I decided for first aid kit I wasn't ready to talk about the drink yet because I'd still know. [00:05:45] Speaker C: Peted Dune yeah and if, if you're, we're obviously we're doing an early show today because I think we're hopefully both going to go to MCs later on for Steven Young. His band MCs got the Duncan on the drums. We get to see him rocking it on a drum kit. I'm listening play drums for ages. And the folk drama supporting as well. So if anyone's looking for something to do tonight, that's the place to be. And that's why the Friday night phone in is on a, on a Friday afternoon. [00:06:14] Speaker B: I love, I love Stevie Young. I think he's an amazing songwriter. I love the Imagineers. God, doing the drums is amazing but I don't know too much about folk drama. What, who are they? What kind of stuff are they doing? Mark. [00:06:25] Speaker C: Brilliant. It's Aaron and you know what, you know, you might know Aaron right in his, his wife's American. Mexican American I think LA from la. We've had them the show before but they're amazing man. It's kind of stripped back acoustic harmonies. Just good songs man. Good songs. Kind of like almost like a throwback to the, a simpler 60s 70s vibe I would say. I hope they don't but, but it's got that, I mean that in the best way. I mean it like it's got the each song Sounds like a. Like a hat record, you know, like a. A classic sound they've got. [00:07:04] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:07:04] Speaker C: And they're dead nice as well. So, yeah, I want to see them also. So. Yeah, hopefully. I'm just waiting to find out if. Where. How long I'm staying at French House just now. So I'm waiting to see when I'm. How long I'm allowed to stay here for. Am I here till today, tomorrow or Sunday? And then I'm trying to figure out if I'm going island or I'm going to. [00:07:25] Speaker B: Or I'm not in Ireland. What's happening in Ireland? [00:07:29] Speaker C: It's a country. It's called. It's a country called Ireland. I'm going for my Irish citizenship and we've got an Irish tour in November, but this is just to see some friends and family. And then I was going because it's a. We're playing Equinox Festival next Friday and that's quite a long. It's like six, seven hours and a. A car. So I was like, well, I'll just make my way. There's no point in coming all the way back to Scotland. So hopefully was going to go to Ireland and fly back to Leeds, but. And then make my way for there, which isn't that bad. But, man, my foot, My broken foot's still playing up. I think it's a bad idea. No, I think I'm just gonna make my way. [00:08:12] Speaker B: I was, I was loving at Soapy Fest when I was up the back watching and I clocked you sitting in the seats up at the back, legitimately sitting in the seats in the back with your moon boot up. I'm like, well, you. [00:08:27] Speaker C: I had the accessibility pass, so obviously I was using it. I was using it for the right reason. But yeah, going to the airport, you know, people like. Oh, you just. You just tell them that you get accessibility in the wheel, your boot and all that. And I just feel like, ah, it's going to be too much hassle, man. I'm not gonna do it. I am just going to scrap island this week and do it, do it, do it. We're going. I'm going next month anyway. So. November the. Sorry, November 7th, 8th and 9th. Dublin, Dundalk and Derry. The three Ds. Yeah, it's a long journey for the. For here to Equinox. So it's like you did the long journey to Boomtown. I remember that when you were playing Gyros. [00:09:04] Speaker B: I mean, that was pro. [00:09:06] Speaker C: Sorry, because that was like. That was really hot, man. And I Don't know if you were. You were sober then or you were. I can't remember. Were you just starting sobriety or. [00:09:16] Speaker B: I think. I think I. I've always known. I've always known I had a problem with my drinking and I always known that I should have quit a long time ago, but I just wasn't. But I hadn't started my, my like public or like, you know, or admitting it to myself journey yet. So, you know that I think I drank. But I drank one night. The first night when we go to Boomtown, I drank and then the next day I was wiped it because it was just so hot. I've never experienced that, just that hangover with that. With that heat. So I never drank the rest of the time, which is. Which is unlike me back then. But that was amazing. It was, it was. It was the maddest festival I've ever been to. [00:10:06] Speaker C: Yeah, there's nothing that compares to it. No, it's a lot. Look, I'm not. I was. I was asked if I wanted to go back. Well, they told me to come to ask to get back in touch about the following year. But I think it's just one of those places that you've got to go once to experience or maybe once every couple years. I don't fancy doing it every year, but once again, that was a. It was 36 degrees when we were on stage. 36 in a desert. And it's like a desert environment. Everyone talks about Boom Town long because, like when you come back you're just kind of sort of coughing up mud and dirt and stuff. It's quite mad that it exists, like. [00:10:49] Speaker B: But I mean I. I looked it through the artist camping to the punter camping and it looked like Mad Max. [00:11:01] Speaker C: Yeah, we. We did have the advantage of the artist company was actually dead nice. It was quite quiet. And then we also had the advantage of. There was like a wee bus that. An artist bus crew bus that kind of takes you around. So when you're like carrying stuff, you go out like a. A shortcut. But yeah, I don't know if going as a punt or would. Would be more difficult, but at least he done it. At least as a punter you don't have to try and perform in 36 degree. I don't know what it's like as a drummer, but as a singer. The first two songs I started enjoying myself and then I started kind of moving a bit and I was like, hold on, you've got another 45 minutes. Camden, Camden. Elvis Presley. [00:11:45] Speaker B: I loved you Wearing the wee shade hat. Yeah. [00:11:51] Speaker C: Yes. If that was going to do anything in 36 degrees, it was boiling, man. And I mean, I don't. So what. What was it like doing a drum? What was it like as a drummer in that heat? [00:12:04] Speaker B: The weekends of water, they were getting it. They were like worth our weight in gold from earlier because, like, they were. They weren't the cheap plus. So every. Every time I was. Because we played two sets. [00:12:20] Speaker C: Yeah, we did wanna. But we did one about 3 o' clock at the 36 degree heat and then we did one, I think about half 10 at the old Copper. Old Copper Town, I think it's called. Yeah. So I. So there was a raider of some beer and some water. [00:12:35] Speaker B: So I just filled my pockets with that. What they'd be cans of water. It was. It was extremely hot. I didn't enjoy it and I knew that on the Sunday I had. We had to drive back early, get up early in the morning to drive to Edinburgh because I was playing with Mellow party at the Dr. Bell's baths. We kill Faulkner. [00:12:58] Speaker C: Yeah, that's wild, man. That's too much. [00:13:02] Speaker B: It's daft. It's. But hey, we say it's daft every single, single time we do something like that. We say, I shouldn't really do that. We're getting a bit too old. And you just keep doing it anyway. Yeah, I need to. I need to watch how many airs or M's. I say, because my girlfriend's dad. I was speaking to him because I was on Ronnie McGee's radio show the other day there, and he just. He dug me up for saying that I kept going. [00:13:31] Speaker C: I do as well sometimes. [00:13:34] Speaker B: He was. He was saying. He's a. He's a Church of Scotland minister. And he was saying, you know, as a professional public speaker, I'll give you a few tips. And I was like, you know, you're a bit different for when you're. For when you're at church to when you're at him. What is that all about? And he's like, it's got a alter ego. You can't. [00:13:58] Speaker C: But the thing is, he's cheating. He's just basically doing a spoken word set. Because it's not what you're going to get the airs and the ums during a poem, because you know what you're actually performing, you're going to say. So the. The flip side of it is, as I have tried to bring it back in, but the only way to do that is by having a really good idea of the sentence you're going to say before you say it. But the problem with that is, is you're going to get more awkward silences. [00:14:31] Speaker B: Because you don't, you don't want dead air. It's the cardinal sin. And he's, he's sort of. I think he's a great guy. And he's just, he's just a cardinal. He likes, he likes to wind me up and plus slice. [00:14:47] Speaker C: Slice. Hang in it for. Anybody doesn't know slice refers to a square sausage. Is it just an answer thing? [00:14:57] Speaker B: Everybody usually says square sausage everywhere else. I think. I don't know. [00:15:00] Speaker C: Everyone's square. Or, or just assuming that the sausage is going to be square if you're in, if you're in Scotland. But forget about the rolling slice because obviously we want a become big. You call that radios? It's time for us to reach the heights of Joe Rogan, the heights of James English. And I didn't know this until we were, we just talked backstage, but you've got an Ayahuasca story. So this is maybe the moment that you call that radio becomes mainstream. [00:15:33] Speaker B: I. So I, I got, I got sober and that wasn't enough. My mental health still been really, really. I've been struggling. I have borderline personality disorder, which is comorbid way major depressive disorder. And that's just been my whole life. And so I tried to get back in touch with mental health services. And in Ayrshire, they don't offer dialectoral behavioral therapy, which is what you would use to treat people with a borderline personality disorder. [00:16:03] Speaker C: What is. Sorry, just interrupted. What is directoral behavior? What's that? [00:16:07] Speaker B: I think it uses, it uses a lot. You know how CBT is cognitive behavioral therapy? [00:16:12] Speaker C: I know that one. Yep. [00:16:14] Speaker B: So dialectical behavioral therapy. Jordan must have been able to tell you more about this. And we actually played, we actually played a CBT conference like last week. And over the mic there was like 15,000 therapists and CBT and DBT specialists. And I said, I am someone who is suffering with borderline personality disorder. If anybody has any information or a card of they want to take me on. If you walk around, then that'd be great. And nobody, nobody come up to me. Anybody. It's like, you know, you say somebody, can you organize a piss up and a brew? I couldn't get, I couldn't get help in an arena full of therapists, my man. So I'd. So a few months back, I was speaking to John because I'd looked at the, the Ketamine therapy that you could. That. But it's really expensive. It takes a while to get an nhs and if you're going private, it's like six grand or something. So I was speaking to John and, and he was like, oh, you know, somebody I know had come back for an ayahuasca retreat and said it was one of the most amazing experiences of life and it's really helped them and stuff. And I was like, oh, really? I've heard a bit about this ayahuasca. Let me tell them to get me in touch with the people that. That run the retreat. So the retreat was in Malaga, wasn't it? Just in some warehouse in Motherville. It was. So they got the information, spoke to the woman over the phone and she was. She's. She's like for west of Scotland. So she had this like. [00:17:53] Speaker C: I saw. [00:17:54] Speaker B: Here's the thing, I was like, you know, the, the ayahuasca is like a spirit, right? It's a kind of spirit kind of thing and you've got to believe it in it. It's a spirit and it will, it will heal you and it will get you. And she had said to me that, you know, the. It will be for a lot of people, it will help the addictions. You will get a belief in something bigger than yourself, like a belief in a God or something. I don't believe in anything. I wish I did. I'm envious of people today and that it would help with, you know, self development. Starting to love myself because I hate myself. And so I was like, I'm on board, let's do it, let's book me up. So I arrived and one of the first conversations I had with one of the guys that was going to be Dan the ayahuasca. He was an Irish, A lot of Irish football there. And he goes, colin, just looking forward to speaking to the Galactic Federation. And I was like, what? And he's like, the Galactic Federation. So he was. He's talking about. He believes that there's this galactic Federation out there that can. That help us on control everything and all that kind of stuff, right? Anybody. And then the first. So they take us through these groups and. And there's a lot of different types of people, a lot of folk with money basically. And I'd. Can I say them? I'm not a rich person. This is like, this is. I've invested in this because I want to get better and I want to help myself and all these things that I want a, you know, get rid of. And I was Being really in this group format, I was being really open. And then folk were just like, some guy that was a trust fund guy was like, yeah, I'm just really hoping to, to. To get to mother Earth and to get, get to experience the buzz of ayahuasca. I'm like, all right. But I was, I was, I was, I was. And I was keeping my open mind. I was trying my best to keep an open mind. And at dinner that night, during discussions, somebody said, I. I believe that you choose your parents before you're born. And I was like, you have no met Dorian then, have you? And they were like, no, no, no, but that's your spirit. That's your spirit choosing because your, your journey and your spirit form. You must have needed this second thing. And I was like, what about like crack babies or like stillborn Waynes and stuff like that? That's like, they definitely. What. What benefit is that? And then a few folk were like, I've got that. That's actually interesting. And then, you know, they did that thing where they go, look who they are. Run away. The equivalent. The. But then I. The actual ceremony itself was that night. There was. So you're in on the Thursday and you stay to the Monday. So there's three ayahuasca experience trips, one, one after the other. The second day there was the Campbell, which is. I think I still got the marks here. I don't know, the bum three dots into your. We'll get to that. And then they put frog poison on you. Then there' these eye drop stuff. I think they were called. Oh, what they called Segura or something like that. Anyway, so the first, I'm keeping an open mind even though everybody's, you know, wild to a Marsburg, there's a guy sitting next to me for Clyde Bank. Thank you as. So everybody else was Irish, American, English and French and a Mexican. And we're all ordering this big room and a sweet bed. You get a sweet bed and you get the bucket because you're gonna purge. That's the word for either spewing, shining, yawning snot. Everything, everything's like, everything's a pudge when you're, when you're doing it. Apparently. If you're gonna get in my tone right now, I didn't have the best experience that everybody else gets. So this is, this is why if you have maybe foreshadowing that it's not going to go that well anyway, so they say you take the ayahuasca, you drink it one by one. Everybody Drinks it and the shaman's there and he's doing the thing and so he's singing to it. I'm not gonna still then the singing that he does but like as just words and that is just a song that you're singing essentially. And it's just like try to talk. It could have been like singing. [00:22:37] Speaker C: Is it tribal stuff? So you don't. A different. A different language you don't understand. [00:22:41] Speaker B: Exactly. But it might as well have been like, I don't know, Savage Garden or something like that. But there was like four leaders and then there was the shaman and the shaman's sidekick. So then we'll take it. And then 15 minutes goes by and then there's a lassie up the left corner for me. She starts going, please, I don't like this. Please let it go. Please let it take it away from me. Please, I can't do this. I can't do this. And I'm like, that doesn't bode well. And then the guy beside me just starts hueing and I'm just looking and then. So I'm not feeling it didn't taste that great, but I'm not feeling it. And then he's like riding on the ground and he's rolling in his bed and he starts going, Johnny, is that you? Johnny? How's it going, pal? You alright? You alright? Aye, then somebody will spew up the corner and he will, ah, I came here, I came the feeling. I came the feeling. And then he starts like, like pure, like banging the ground going, rangers, Rangers. We're going. He won the league. We're going. He won the cup. I'm like, I come on the way to mal got to have a spiritual experience and I'm. And I'm straight back to co winning. [00:23:56] Speaker C: It's. Look, I. I met some Rangers fans and mushrooms before so I know, I can relate. I can relate. That was an interesting one. [00:24:05] Speaker B: What was, what was it like? What were they like? [00:24:07] Speaker C: Well, they were singing, singing Ranger songs. But they were on mushrooms so it was just like. It was. I just never thought of that before. I just never thought that, you know, it's. No, the mushroom experience doesn't seem to co align with hello, hello or anything. [00:24:30] Speaker B: No, I'm so. [00:24:31] Speaker C: I'm sure, I'm sure there's some of our listeners or our viewers are Rangers fans that enjoy magic mushrooms. I just, I'm not saying that I just, I just never. I just never thought about it that way. [00:24:41] Speaker B: I know you. [00:24:42] Speaker C: A psychedelic experience seems so far away from football and Far away from Rangers and far away from Koanen. You know what I mean? [00:24:50] Speaker B: Exactly. No, I totally get your point. And that's. That's exactly. [00:24:55] Speaker C: And I've got it. I've got it in my phone notes. Rangers fans and Mushrooms, like for a lyric. I don't know how that's going to. What. I don't have anything else to add to that lyric. [00:25:03] Speaker B: But maybe you could explore. Because sometimes with these things we have these biases. [00:25:11] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:25:11] Speaker B: That you can maybe explore your bias. Swear. Or you could explore the social. Because that, that in itself is a great concept. [00:25:19] Speaker C: Well, if I. If I brought a song called Rangers Fans and Mushrooms, people are hit and play. They're hitting play because I want to see what I'm going to say about it. And the thing is, I don't even know what to say about it. I'm still confused about it. Going back to your. So you've got a guy, you're taking ayahuasca. Everyone's having a bad time, apart from the Rangers guy who's just singing Rangers tunes. Mother Nature, or I think she's called Pashama. Am I right in saying that? Mother Nature as a Rangers fan. [00:26:01] Speaker B: So the idea is you, when you're sitting. It's in the dark, they're playing music, you're sitting there and the idea is to think of your intention. What is your intentions? So that when Mother Ayahuasca comes and speaks to you, you can. Whether it's, you know, for me it was, please, I just want to know that you exist and there is a higher power or whatever. That was my first intention that I wanted to kind of go through. And then that, that the Galactic Federation guy is right beside me and he's getting all that. And I'm just like, I don't belong here, man. So we're sitting there and I sort of start to feel like, oh, here I'm feeling like something's happening there. And I lied in for a bit and then the woman comes up to me and she taps and she goes, we're going to do the healing ceremony now. Can you take your T shirt off? So, right, okay. So all the guys are lined up and I'm starting to feel it. Do you know what I mean? And there's. We're all lined up and so the. The shaman comes up and he's spitting this stuff in her face and he's like cracking away a leaf. Build a face. And then I'm looking to the right of me and there's like, some guys like, you know that there was one guy, like, properly. His face was melting off and I'm. I'm looking and because it was so. It must have been because there was so many Irish people. And I was trying not to do an Irish accent. Just loads of fire Ted quotes jumped in the head and I shouted out loud, here we all are now, all the lads. And then the woman come up and said, colin, straight, you need to focus. You need to focus. All right? Okay. Sorry, Sorry. So, like, I can really start to feel something happening. I went back to my seat, my bed, and I eventually start spewing. And then that has been just. Oh, oh, hell. Brutal. And just. I felt like every single negative emotion that you can feel as a human being, I was feeling it all at once, like. Like times 10. The. The room was just constantly spinning. If I close my eyes, it get worse. I was like, just the most nausea you've ever had in your life. I was trying not to myself and I was just like. And my whole concept of time just went. Went to. [00:28:21] Speaker C: What's the toilet situation like? Because you've got about 12 people all needing a shit. [00:28:29] Speaker B: There's. There's 20 people, 20 guests doing ayahuasca. There's four people. [00:28:37] Speaker C: Shaman, shaman. [00:28:39] Speaker B: So the shaman, the shape shaman. The shaman, shamans. Shaman, shaman. The shaman. Shaman's sidekick and four leaders. So. But everybody is as. Then everybody's on ayahuasca. Neighbors. No, apparently that's what you need today. There's two compost toilets at the back. They said before we start it, if we need a pee, we need to go and ask permission from a tree. So you need to walk up to the trees. It's all right if I. If I pass you on you. [00:29:10] Speaker C: So, I mean, I thought we're gonna have to ask like, the. The head. The head honcho or something, but that's fine. You're asking a Troy. I mean, what. The tree says no. What if the tree says no? What are you supposed to do then? [00:29:27] Speaker B: I mean, if you're the kind of person that can. That can receive messages for trees, they'll never say. They're never going to say no to you. They're always your best pal. So there's two compost toilets outside. And I went to, like, dp and when I opened the door, I was just. And I looked up at the sky. You know, I've never seen the stars like this in my life coming at me. And then I went to get in the toilet. And it's because it's a compost toilet. It Stinks. And I went to put my foot in, but, like, the. The base of the thing was so far away and it felt like my leg. I had to, like, really stretch my leg right to get in. And then I come out and I was just like. And I collapsed and I cracked my bad knee that I shattered a couple of years back on the ground. And I'm just, like, lying there and I'm convulsing, spewing up or myself, Help me. Somebody help. And then somebody comes up and says, do you need help? And I'm like, yes, please. And then, like, everything's going to be fine. And in the end, I'm like, when will it end? And then. So I'm not getting any. Anytime I close my eyes, I'm getting all this kind of hellish H.G. geiger landscapes where, like, folk getting their flesh torn off and all that, and like, orgies and just like. [00:30:48] Speaker C: Just a horrible. [00:30:49] Speaker B: You ever seen that film Society? It's a body horror film. Is it called Society? It's like. There's like. It's a kind of metaphor for, like, yuppies. And I've not seen it. [00:31:01] Speaker C: Just. I'm just trying to get. I'm trying to imagine the. The visuals and stuff. Is it. Is it anyway compatible at all with acid or mushrooms or DMT or anything like that? Isn't it as dmt? It's just. It's not the DMT that we would know because DMT's quick. [00:31:22] Speaker B: Yeah. So I had a really, really bad acid experience a few years ago that just. Just lasted and lasted. And I realized when. When it. Finally, when I committed that the medication that I was on, I think it was mirtazapine at the time, and that that was like one of the worst medications you could be on. We're taking acid because it just, like. It was horrible, man. So. [00:31:48] Speaker C: So is it comparable? [00:31:50] Speaker B: Are we, you know, focus there, isn't he. I mean, it's intense and it just. It's. It's more intense, but you can compare it, you know, I mean, if it felt like it was years and years and years, Mark, it felt just like it wasn't going to end. And it was years and years and I ended up, at one point, I'm holding on to, like, the pole of the canopy, screaming out, help me or kill me. So that was my first experience. That was the first. That was the first night doing it. And then you. [00:32:26] Speaker C: Then you do it. Then they meet you there again. [00:32:28] Speaker B: Yeah. So the next day I woke up, I'm like, so that the. The ceremony starts at 10 at night and it finishes at 5 in the morning because it lasts that long. Then you sleep there until you. You're. You're well enough to go up to your room. [00:32:44] Speaker C: Did you get a good sleep? Are you tired? [00:32:46] Speaker B: I was shattered, man. I was done in. I was like, you sleep it off. [00:32:52] Speaker C: Can you. Do you just. Do you have a good night's kip after all that, or is it shite? [00:32:58] Speaker B: You just keep, like, the. The stuff never ends. And yet, like, I spent all night fighting David Cronenberg monsters and knew I've got to get up and take this frog poison. So we go in and I was up in my room for like an hour or two. Then you get shouted. Then you're doing the. It's called Campbell. So they burnt three whole three dots into the arum, and then they put it on. And then I would. Honestly, within about 45 seconds, like, my body started to tangle. The temperature in my body just started to increase. I started to sweat. And then I shot myself. And I was like, did I shut myself there? I'm not sure. And then I was just like. Because I've written. All ears of Gracie's were away because everybody's been spewing all that. I was like, I need to go. I've shot myself. So I take the bucket. I take the. But. And then when I. When I look back at the bed, it seeps through my shorts. Do you know what I mean? So I take my bucket into the compost toilet, and I'm just in that compost toilet, and folk are trying to get in because they're shitting and they want to shut and off, and they're like, let me in. I'm like, okay. So I'm sitting in this hot box, sweating, spewing, and. And just snot and everything. Covered it for about 45 minutes. So that was camp. But that was supposed to. Campbell's supposed to get rid of all your, like, toxins and whatever other stuff in your gut or whatever. So then we have this group session later on where everybody can talk about their experience and all that. And so then the Fruit Loops really are coming at their shell. So one of the women. And I swear to God, this is true. I would not lie about this. This woman had said she was American woman. She said, so I feel really safe in this group enough to tell you that I'm a sleeper agent for the American government. I was groomed by MK Ultra when I was a little girl. And what I want to do is heal from my past trauma. Generational trauma. Not the generational trauma from my parents or my grandparents. The generational trauma from when I was a triceratops during dinosaur times. So first of all, like, she's. I've not finished what she said yet. Right. So first of all, she's a sleeper agent, right? New. She's also a triceratops. And the dinosaur times when we were allowed to talk, I put my horn up and I said, if you, if you really believe you, you were your triceratops, wouldn't you at least find out what period that was instead of calling it dinosaur things? Do you know? Do you know what I mean? And then she said, and also, I have a direct link with George Lucas. And I was like, awesome, you've got George Lucas's number. He's like, star wars guy. You got his number. He's like, I have a telepathic link with George Lucas. And I'm still trying to keep an open mind. The thing is, everybody, all the folk that are leading this are like, yes, yes, you do. Of course you do. I'm like, am I the. Like, I'm mad, right? I'm. I'm mad. But when I'm the one that's the least mad in the room that you've got, you've got a problem. It was almost like because. And I've also been in a psychiatric world. It was almost like the. The nurses had went, you, you, you are in charge. We're off. That's what it kind of felt like. Then this other woman talked about how she was trying to go over because she was the Virgin Mary in a past life, and she was trying to go over her birth and the savior of humanity, Jesus Christ. And then just again, was trying my best to like, oh, hell, it was just full of the lost, the lonely, the broken and the damned. And I was one of them. And, you know, I mean, I was there trying my best, and I was like, I don't think I'm going to do this ayahuasca the night for the second time. I don't think I'm going to do it. And I was kind of talked into it and peer pressure, I suppose, but I suppose I spent that money. I might as well go and I might as well get in the. The whole hog, or whatever. So I go in there and I take a. They give me a lesser strength dose because they know that I didn't have a great time the first time. And I'm still, when I'm looking in the room, I'm seeing Folk, their eyes are all weird and looking like almost like demonic and you're hearing all the time and focal lying about it was like being a horrible like afters that you know you've been it before that everybody's just like see that the moment when everybody's just about to lie doing or they're being sick or whatever and like the sun's coming through the wind day and the birds are chirping, folk are going to work, Waynes are going to school. All that guilt, you're like oh I hate. And it was kind of flooding. That kind of stuff was flooding back to me. I was like oh no this isn't again. So. But there was a. There was a moment during that second experience that I brought my notepad with me and I drew. If I am willing to put myself through all of us knowing what happened on the first night just to get better, I must love myself like even that much. Do you know what I mean? So there was a sort of positive in that. But when I said that in the group the next day they all said that was. That was Pachimama. Pachi Mama. It was saying that to you. Well Pachamama sounds a lot like me. Do you know what I mean? Pachimama, it's got a west coast of Scotland voice. Do you know what I mean. [00:39:01] Speaker C: Much Mother Nature or God or whatever other people perceive as God. It's in your own. Was it in your own image design and your own image. So that's. That's a good get out. That's a good get out of that one. She's got an airshell less so I. [00:39:20] Speaker B: Remember actually like that sentiment. I was in. Commander, can I walk past? There was an American guy with like the end of his nice spouting stuff about the Bible and he said I was saying something like. He started talking to me. I wasn't even asking to speak to him. I was just like what's going on here? And it's like what about you sir? Are you a vegan? I'm like no. I said we can eat animal. He says we can eat animals. That you believe it's all right to. I goes well it's. It's a bit, you know, great area. And he goes but God made man in his own image. And I was just like no, man made God in his image. That's. [00:40:04] Speaker C: That's what it is. [00:40:05] Speaker B: That's the zinger. But then we get into a heated argument and I ended up calling my dick and walking away so that I'm not really good at debating. [00:40:15] Speaker C: Yeah, he won the argument. I mean that's a guy that debates all day. He's a master, a master debater. So let's go back to. Okay, let's go back to the ayahuasca trip. So that do you. So you do it twice. Is that you free after that? Are you allowed to leave? Are you. You going to do a third night? [00:40:34] Speaker B: No. So we're supposed to do it a third night. So we all met up and I'm sure I'm missing stuff out. There's stuff I've written down about this because. And those things that, that you know, I've done videos when I was there, try to keep just so I don't forget the wee things because I want to write about it. But so they said that the third. So we had a meeting and they said the third night isn't going to go ahead because the police are onto his. And if the police arrive, please say that this is just a yoga medit. And I'm like, I thought this was legit. I paid, I paid 1200 quid. [00:41:21] Speaker C: Yeah, I kind of just when you think it kind of get any worse, you know, I mean you're, you're fighting demons, monsters, everyone spewing and shaking everywhere and then the police raid it. God. And true or false, you're not even allow to eat food or anything. Like it's like you can't even have a breakfast. [00:41:41] Speaker B: So you. [00:41:42] Speaker C: All the, all this, all the toxins with your body. [00:41:45] Speaker B: I. So you. Yeah, I'll say this. The woman that the resort that we were staying in was, was gorgeous. It was beautiful. And I was sharing the room with an older Irish guy who's a cormic. Who's a. I got on him so much. But I just be that by this time now I'm just, I'm over it. I want him but like I'm, I'm there. And so there were certain things that they were saying. They were, you know, this woman who I really Got only she's 57 year old from Middlesbrough and she had Ms. And she, she struggled with, you know, beliefs and was really resistant to any sort of therapy just like myself. So I really identified wearing, got along there. But she had said during a group session that when she was younger she always thought she was going to get some disease and knew she's got ms, she feels guilty or whatever. And then the, the, the group folk started saying to her, oh, you manifested your Ms. Off you can. It's hot. Me, I had to go and speak to her after that I was like, you did not manifest your ms, just so you know. And then they said, you can manifest that away using ayahuasca. So I had to go, there was another guy that's trust fund guy that had said to that same woman or you know, I had a little, little bit of trouble with depression in the past because, you know, some things happened in my life and I was on different antidepressants and what happens. I got off that and I, I was watching a podcast and they told me that I could use magnesium and B12 and it. And it helped me and I just turned and I was like, mate, you don't know what you're talking about. Like, like, no, like, this is a clinical problem she has. Like, do you think that a vitamin B12 capsule once a day is going to help somebody? The schizophrenic. Oh, you. What have you got there? Electrolyte. [00:44:02] Speaker C: It's energy tonic, it's called. It's like a. We're not sponsored. Right. And it's just a. But I just got magnesia, vitamin B12. Vitamin B12, some electrolytes, stuff like that. I just have one once a day. It's got, it's got calcium in it as well. It's for my broken foot. But in general it's good for my, my, you know, festival season, drinking too much, bad diet. Just get the vitamins in you. But yeah, I wouldn't say it's not going to stop schizophrenia. [00:44:32] Speaker B: Hi. It's not, it's not gonna. Like, there's the evidence. As, as, like as they have to say. [00:44:41] Speaker C: It may give you a bit more energy. It might make you sleep better. I've got the rest and recover one as well. And this has got, I can't remember hikes, ashwagandha and magnesium in that one. And that's so that you have. You can have that in the morning to give you some energy and you can have that at night and you. Yes, I think it might work. Yes. And you get more energy and you get a better sleep. We're not talking about complex debilitating illnesses are going to be cured by it. And I hate if I, I hate the manifest people that said they manifested an illness and they can cure it. We manifest and I hate that shit. And also my other question, because we're just. Before we get. Before we go too far away from the Polish raid, do you think how did they know the polls were going to read that? Did the, the triceratops lady grass them up to the police or did they feel that the triceratops lady maybe was working for MK Ultra? I mean, that seems like. That seems like the wrong environment to be doing something so insane. Why Quivers? I mean, I think they're only checking anybody because MK Ultra woman should probably not be taking ayahuasca. [00:45:49] Speaker B: No, no, again, I don't think anybody should be taking ayahuasca. I don't think anybody. It's like for me, by the end I was just deflated because I thought I had some hope and I really wanted it to work. And I've done everything. There was like a PIA to the court. So you can have sex, eat red meat or drink caffeine, which was half anyway. Or alcohol, which was half anyway. All this stuff. This. The special list I got today for. I done it for three weeks and then I kept all my. I wrote my journals every day. I wrote my intentions. I done everything that I was supposed to do and I get a story, but that's about it. But the. What is Ashwagandha, by the way? [00:46:46] Speaker C: Ashwagandha is good because. Actually, no, I've got a wee bit of experience for that one because Joe took it for our. For sleeping and back pain. I think. Just general, I think. I think it's a very, It's a very mild, Very mild. I mean it's. I would suppose it's not like a benzo or anything like that. It's much, much milder than that. It's maybe like a hot, a nice hot boval before your bed or something. It's like a boval. It's not a ball, it's not benzo, it's a boil fruit. It's harmless. But yeah, it does see that way. I mean, it's not going to knock you out or anything. It's not like a Zooplacorn or like a sleeping tablet, but if you, you know, that way, if you're kind of in the middle of maybe over mind maybe thinking a bit too much and you're just kind of in that, but you're actually genuinely tired and you're. But your mind's maybe thinking a bit too much, then I'll be. Ashwagandha can help, I would say, and magnesium, things like that. But they're very. I mean, I don't know if the evidence is there to support it, but for me personally, maybe it's a placebo effect, but maybe just having something like that makes you go, I've taken the pill, so now I'm going to sleep. Maybe that's enough. But I would. I would recommend it but it's not. It's not going to change the world. I don't think it's. [00:48:02] Speaker B: It. It's mad though. Everybody that talks about ayahuasca that everything I researched about it, everybody that I heard was all positive and it's just. [00:48:11] Speaker C: I disagree. I researched that we. We've got mutual friends that have taken it and when they explain it to me and then they always. They tell me this a story pretty much the exact same as you've told me about. Darren Coral's been on the show talking about it with David on the show talking about it. We've had a few people talking about it and it's like it always sounds absolutely terrible and then you should try it. And I'm like you've just explained something terrible. I know you're telling me to try it. Why. Why does do people to join club. [00:48:44] Speaker B: People want you to. To experience the same misery as they miss them. Folk tell you you're like oh, you don't get. You don't get wings yet. And you're like no, I've not got any children. I just wait and see. As I said know. I know because I've. I've seen you. You used to. You used to have life in your eyes. You don't have it anymore. It's a way lifeless eyes, black eyes like a doll's eyes. They don't. [00:49:06] Speaker C: Well no one can have a. A proper conversation about that anyway. Because if you've. If you've got ws, you kind of say don't have wins. They're shy because then that means. And then you get your wins taken after you and you're a. So. So prior a social worker, she can't say that. So maybe you need to live two lives. You need to live two lives back to back consecutively actually at the same time and go right. It's actually better no having them. Or it is better having them going back to the choosing your own parents like so how does that work? Do you get to choose from every single human being that's ever existed of all time? Are we going but. Or is it like just a select. You know, do you get a couple of thousand to choose for or are you talking about every human that's ever lived, lived ever on any country of all time? [00:49:56] Speaker B: You know me, it's. It's the exact same thing where neighbor you see when like you know folk talk to like fortune tellers or spooky women or this, the Galactic Federation, whoever is. They always seem to Tell them that they were like Mark Anthony or Cleopatra or something like that. It's never you. Are we, Jimmy? Are we Susan? It was nothing. Nothing like that at all. Nobody was the guy that felt in the middle of the Titanic. Everybody was somebody special. Do you know what I mean? [00:50:25] Speaker C: First time I've ever heard anyone say there are triceratops. So I'm giving her the benefit, the doubt, to be honest, because that is. It's no like what you said. I don't. I don't like it when they say that, you know, there were a Greek God or, I don't know, a prince or a king. But a triceratops is original. So shout outs to that. That hold up. Watch the comments. Ali Grant saying this is a surreal story. I'm gripped. Kit Kat says he's calling not to be supposed to be promoting his album. Yes, this is the album promo. Can someone clip calling? Just saying that he shot himself and then there you go. That'll get a few likes for you on that point. How should people listen to your album? Have you got one of those little links that has options and I'll put. [00:51:14] Speaker B: It in the comments? I don't know, but it's the Colin Hunter, the King of the Rats. [00:51:22] Speaker C: They can tame it. They could type it up, tape up. [00:51:24] Speaker B: Yeah. It's on all streaming platforms as well as Band Camp. So if you write Band Camp, Colin Hunter. [00:51:36] Speaker C: I just did that and it came up with your Maths Teacher album. So let me just check if this is. Yeah, it's still on, coming up with Math Teacher. [00:51:44] Speaker B: So if you click into. If you just click into that one and then go into calling Hunter, it will show you. It'll show you the King of the rats. You can buy Massachusetts as well. [00:51:54] Speaker C: Yeah, okay. But what you had to do is. Is maybe update your band camp so that your new album comes in when you type it. Because that's how we better. [00:52:03] Speaker B: And folk don't like fitters. Folk don't like food. In a bit. You've went silent, Matt. You went muted. You've muted yourself, son. [00:52:19] Speaker C: Folk on drugs, taking drugs to get off drugs. Is that what it is? [00:52:26] Speaker B: I suppose it was. It was more. I've been off. I'm coming up on 22. No, I. 21 months. 22 months. Super. So it was. It was more. Thank you. So it was more for my sanity, just. I was. I've tried everything you could ever imagine. I've tried medication, meditation, therapy, be it private nhs. I've tried being. Create mere creative. Trying new things. Sporty Always exercise, everything you Cold water showers, cold water swimming, holding. [00:53:09] Speaker C: I seen you eating spicy food because Colin's got a good video on Instagram where he does the cold water therapy and it's spicy food. Spicy food. Try to hold her shine for as long as you can. [00:53:24] Speaker B: All these things on the balance. [00:53:26] Speaker C: On the balance. When you came out, when you came back from Malaga, did you. Did you feel like you were less tempted or more tempted to relapse, would you say so? [00:53:36] Speaker B: I was a bit, I was a bit tempted, I will say that, because I was really deflated. I was just a loss of hope. This was like a Hail Mary for me. And we get out of there, we get taken to the airport, but my flight wasn't for another seven hours. So everybody was kind of the same and they were going to go to the beach and they'd said to me, do you want to wait in the airport or do you want to come to the beach with us? And I said I'm going to wait in the airport music and I'll tell the Galactic Federation I was asking for them. And, and I went to sit and I paid like 40 quid or whatever and sat in the lounge so I could get something to eat and just sit there the food day, charge my phone, get the Internet and all that. But when I went to go up to get food and the food was great but the. They had like a bar for like the drink and like loads of. And it just made me had that thought. I looked at it for like 30 seconds, just gone. But then I, I talked myself with it because once you have that thought, you're going to kill that thought. So I talked myself with it, phoned a few folks and, and then there's a, so there's a, there's. I spoke to my sponsor about it and, and he's 82 year old and he was like, he flipped me back up and he's like, I was having a wee hunk about that Wally Waska that you were doing. I'm like, no, it's, it's ayahuasca. No, it's. You said it was Wally Wasa. I was like, no, no, it's ayahuasca. So there's, there's a group chat for the Wolly Waska for the folk that were there and like the leaders and stuff and some, the, the same guy that talked about the vitamin B12 for curing depression and stuff like that had said, I mean this is mad. He starts talking about how you should start taking turpentine Put it on your skin and drinking wee bits it. And I'm like, under no circumstances should anybody ingest turpentine, even putting on your skin. Well, you what your skin will absorb it. It's not good for you. They say, oh, it gives rid of the parasites and stuff like that. I'm like, yeah, it's natural. It comes for a tree. I thought, there's trees out there that will kill you. [00:55:56] Speaker C: There's berries right there that will kill you. [00:55:58] Speaker B: How much are natural things will kill you. This is natural. [00:56:03] Speaker C: It's like the time Donald Trump told everyone to drink bleach to cure covered. So that's a thing. It's quite a popular belief that that like bleach or anything like, you know, kitchen things can. Can. But don't do that, by the way. [00:56:18] Speaker B: Don't. [00:56:19] Speaker C: Don't do that, everyone. If it's got bones on it, that means it's probably not drinkable, despite what other people might tell you. [00:56:28] Speaker B: Yeah, I was talking. [00:56:30] Speaker C: Sorry. The album or back to Aya. But the thing is, why Malaga as well? Because I thought you had to go to. Was it like South Latin America for these things? I mean, I've been in Malaga a few times. I've got friends that stay in the south of Spain. So I've actually stayed in Malaga a few times. And it's a lovely little town, man. And. [00:56:51] Speaker B: They fly a sham shaman from Colombia. So the shaman and the shaman's pile comes and the thing is, see, like the shaman like there was times where when he was looking at me that near the end that I was like, you're looking at me because I think, you know that this is all right. I was getting that vibe. But there was like times where was going through the. The first and second night of the ceremony and you know, like they're playing music and it's like actually it's meant to soothe your trip. But it just made me. It just made it worse for me. Like I say I probably better off a savage garden Willie Waska is that. [00:57:36] Speaker C: Noah pub and aired in the Sandgate says Raymond and I've been corrected every single actually couldn't said that he was inject bleach. It wasn't drinking. Don't do that either. Don't do that either. [00:57:51] Speaker B: No. [00:57:53] Speaker C: Go back to your album. Let's go back to your album. Every minute. [00:57:55] Speaker B: Right? [00:57:56] Speaker C: Because I was. I had. What was it? I liked. I had a couple of highlights. So obviously with first aid kit which I've already talked about there was wind swept and uninteresting which I really like the way. And I'd rather be a bag of shade than a shape bag. And I'll come to your funeral if you come to me. So what's that one about? [00:58:14] Speaker B: So that is a bit about not. That's basically not feeling comfortable in my own skin or with other humans. Feeling like I'm apart. I'm no even like any situation I'm in, I just feel like an outsider. But that line, I'd rather be a bag of shit than a shape bag. There was one day I was hiding. It's my ex wife and I was hiding in the cupboard for like 15 minutes because I could see her getting at the motor and coming up the stairs, whatever. So I was hiding. I was hiding there for 15 minutes and I came out, I was like. And like I would always there and she called me a bag. And I said firstly it's shite bag. Secondly, shape bag means theory. Like you're scared and I'm not a shite bag. What you're meaning is I'm a bag of shit. And I'll tell you something new. I would rather be a bag of shit than a shite bag. [00:59:10] Speaker C: Remember that time you were playing the Harbour Arts Center Northern where Tragica Hara and the DRO and the drum kit started running away from you. So basically the drum kit's bouncing away and you're like what we going to do? And everyone's laughing, just living what are we going to do? And everyone was just laughing and there's no solution. I thought that was funny kids. Everyone just. You're like day and the whole place just in stitches. [00:59:48] Speaker B: But that's the thing. There's so many things like gigging on in real life when I say something and I'm being serious and folk are just laughing at me like. Like I. I remember I get broken up with years ago and there was a gig I was meant to be playing. I didn't know why I play it and I was like I would rather not be here. And folks start laughing. So I kind of leaned into it. I leaned into it and I turn it too far because you know, Navy likes being quite a cuz. But the, But I, the At least. [01:00:18] Speaker C: He'S got to play that night. We didn't end up playing. We ended up. We get banned. That's where that line comes from. Jackal Train song I had a band from here, so they get banned from Aerial because they wouldn't let us play. And then we go, they just said nah, because it started late. And then by the time we were coming on they just said no, your drummer's too drunk to play. He's not too drunk to play. He's always laugh that he's fine. But we did, we did. Yeah, we didn't get. [01:00:45] Speaker B: But that, that. That night at the Harbor Art C. I think it was Stub that volunteered himself to come and sit in front of the cat with just his feet just like that against the. The kit drum. [01:01:01] Speaker C: Yes. So what you normally would in that situation you would want about a carpet or something to put underneath the drum. Car it. But shout outs to the hack. Oh, I would like. I'd like to go back I was thinking because obviously I do feel like after I've promoted this al. This current album I'd like to take away well, at least that hiatus of some sort and write. Try and write a book. And I thought what? You need an ending for the book. So I've got two options. One is either playing in Europe because it's always been my bucket list to play in Europe even if it's just, you know, 50 people in France or something like that. But the other option is. Is just go to a badly promoted gig in Irving or coining or something and just go back and play the Absolutely Nobody. And then that's. That's a good ending as well, isn't it? [01:01:48] Speaker B: Well, I quite like that idea. I love. There's a. A songwriter who died years ago called Blaze Foley and one of his live albums is just recorded in this. This old. It's just pub. That's this bar out in the sticks and there's like folk. There's only like maybe like 14 folk in and they're not enjoying it but they, but they, but they released it And Angus because he's coming after. He's usually funny come after the doorway. Really, really interesting stuff he was saying. But I. There was something else I was going to say there but it's escaped me. [01:02:26] Speaker C: Well, another song was Someone else's Memories and I like the line. I can't remember who it goes exactly but it's like you're swimming naked with your pals and there was some lasses there from the Protestant school or something like that. [01:02:38] Speaker B: I. So this idea of someone else's memories, it's like as you get older and as you naturally change as a person and you think of things in your life, it's almost like as the youth anywhere or that's. Or you've changed or something's missing or something's different or you know, something's no Good with what's happening anyway. So that was what that was about. And the, the actual line, swimming naked with my best friends and the girls we knew from the Protestant school. That's actually never happened. That's. That was somebody actually somebody else's memories. So I wanted to put that in that it was like that was a camping trip that I wasn't invited to. And I remember coming back, coming into school and sitting in St. Michael's under the stairs and everybody's talking about this amazing camping trip and I was like, how did you not ask me to come? [01:03:34] Speaker C: I feel that about an Ocean Colossian gig at Stirling Castle. Everyone went. And I don't think I got an invite. It wasn't like, it wasn't. I don't think it was pure close friends that all went. But I just felt like, you know, where did, where did you get your Ocean Color Scene CDs from? That's what I feel was saying, you know. Yeah, who. The CD writer. [01:03:57] Speaker B: But that's another thing that can lead us on to another subject, Mark, because sometimes people just don't think. And when it comes to. When you. From you put any sort of content of your. Your band, whether it's a gig, a new release or anything like that, people, some people just don't realize how important it is to share and to like and to support it in that way because it's, it's. We're in a. The likes because it's all about perception. You get good. You get like better gigs if you seem to be doing well. [01:04:35] Speaker C: Yeah, you could just, you could just get a. You could just put. Spend. There's, you know, there's people out there that are spending hundreds and hundreds of pounds every week on their Instagram and then they've got, you know, 10,000 followers and what they're doing well. So the perception, I mean the thing is that that only takes you so far. Especially. I've noticed there's a lot of people in the glass in Glasgow because I know Glasgow well. Is the scene quite well. There's people with ridiculous numbers on their YouTube videos and you know that they, they don't bring anyone to their gigs. So what is the point? Are they. Are they believing their own hype? And that must be disappointing. You know, it's a series of disappointments. I mean, this is how we ended up booking this interview is because you agreed with the. Why your friends don't share Share your music video that I, that I'm just. Because I was just. Just recently got gyros and you call that radio on Instagram. So I'm just starting to put up small content on that just to kind of please the robotic overlords. But yeah, if you start believing your own height, if you let, oh, I get 20, 000 views in my music video. But it was just robots. It was boss. How does that make you feel when you go to the, the gig and there's nobody there? So I do you fall for your own hype. That's what I wonder. I would like. And it's quite hard to get anyone to talk on the record about it because if they're in that world of creating success, then they're not going to be honest about it. [01:06:06] Speaker B: It's. It's funny because you have to in order to thousands upon thousands of songs are released, say on Spotify every single day. And unless it's your pals or folk that know you or the fans that know you, nobody else is gonna. And that's. You need to pay for your fans and your friends to see because the algorithm as well. So not everybody's gonna see you. So you need to pay for that. But if you want to be seen by other people on these streaming platforms, you need to go into playlists. How do you go into playlists? Well, there's certain playlists that are scams and you can end up getting kicked your music removed for Spotify. Then you get certain playlists that, so you can work with like a PR team which, which I, I looked into and they can get your own playlists. [01:06:53] Speaker C: But sometimes you don't. And then you've just a guy that's can't help you. [01:06:58] Speaker B: But that, but here's the thing. You are wanting to make a living from music, so you need to get streams up, you need to get the, the, the, the perception of you doing well as a musician need to get that up. So then you, you pay to get people to look and then the money comes in, but you, but you've not actually even. You're out of pocket. It doesn't, it just doesn't make sense. And I made this point the other day there like, if, if you want to. What is the living. The living wage is like 2, 2006, 20 pounds, 2016 pounds or something like that. That's 11. The living wage. In order to get that, you need to, you know, make about 500 to 850,000 streams a month to make that. Which like, do you know anybody that can do that easily? That's, that's in order to get those streams you have to pay for. [01:08:02] Speaker C: 200, 200 digital downloads. So that's why you should buy. The best thing to do is go and buy calling on this album on Band Camp and then only listen to it on Spotify. That's the way to do it. I don't stream on Band Camp because actually I told some people this is quite a misconception, that streaming it in Band Camp is good, but Band Camp doesn't pay for streams. The reason Band Camp's good is because they actively want people buying physical merch and digital downloads. And what Spotify then was a sneaky one, which it basically said, oh no, you're just putting your music out there without a paywall. And then as a result people will buy your albums and stuff. But they don't. They basically just destroyed physical media and not destroyed it. I mean, we're still selling a few vinyl. I think there's a. I think there's maybe a bit of a, A renaissance, a bit of, of physical. But the Spotify doesn't want that. People Spotify doesn't want you buying anything. They just want you to have that, their app and everything to be on it. And it's a problem. That's a problem. [01:09:09] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:09:11] Speaker C: And why not? Why, why can't I just. Yeah, well, I don't, I don't know what. I didn't use Spotify for the first six months of our album and now as a result, our Spotify streams are quite disappointing compared to what they could have been if we'd just put it all out at the same time. But that was a kind of calculated risk. I kind of knew that would happen. [01:09:32] Speaker B: Do you know something that I was think thinking about for that, that video? There's a few things that I thought the, the am I shape thing was definitely something that popped up, but something that made me think about is my own self and am I sharing enough in my friends stuff. It made me think, and rather than like, I maybe is dead man, it made me think, oh, is it, is that aimed at me? Why am I thinking that's aimed at me? Do you think maybe you don't date enough? Maybe I don't do it enough. And then, you know, so that was, that was. [01:10:03] Speaker C: You get, you get people that they get people that actually unfriend people because they don't share their music and stuff. Something. It gets quite crazy. Like if some other people who have asked to get on this podcast to come promote their thing and I've said, right, I'm a wee bit busy just now, But I'll get back to you and I'm genuinely going to get back to him. I'm just. Life's busy, you know, I mean, I'm trying to do as much as I can and then they just unfriend you and I'm like bumping them in real the world and I'm like, did you unfriend me? And then I just. Because you're on the way. You didn't seem to be that into my music and I'm like, I've got lots of friends that don't like my music as well. It's not like it's. It doesn't. [01:10:43] Speaker B: I get folk. When I was playing drums in Crash Club, I'd folk that will just like stick to the drums, mate. Your song's only that great. And then. And then I would that, that, that maybe on the Anti Melo party, but they like the sourced or whatever and. And that's your powers that you kind of like everything and. But the thing that you have always done of that, again, it's admirable is your ability to promote yourself and your DIY ethic. I. What I would have done in the past is just like, right, make a post my albums that by the way, go and listen and have like a snidey thing like you won't even listen to it anyway or something like, you know, I mean, make one post about my album and then hope that people see it and they don't. And like that's not good enough. You need to be relentless and you, you need to think outside the box and you need to try new things and. And when I decided to eventually pick this album up because it was ready in 2021, but I just, you know, I was hospitalized and loads of other things happened. It's only to know that I've put it out and it's new that I'm like, no, if I respect the work that I've made, I really should be putting as much effort into the promotion as I did to the writing and the recording. [01:12:07] Speaker C: Yeah, but it's tough. It's tough to promote your own stuff. So it's. That's why people do pay people to help them and I'm better promoting other people's stuff than my own stuff. But I've been trying to get into the. The views like just making. Because obviously you're getting into the. Real soon I'm getting reeled in. I'm getting moved into them because obviously because we've got so much stuff for the. The olden days are like, you know, it's like the Instagram's new. So I'm just like putting up an old music video and chopping up 60 seconds of it. Takes a few, you know, if you just upload a meta business suite, then it goes to Facebook and Instagram at the same time. So what. The lead up to the bars gig, I was pretty much putting out a, a new video of some sort. Whether it was a live thing or a music video video or content of some sort. And that seemed to be doing all right. I don't know if it, I don't know. It's hard to tell if it helped with ticket sales. It was hard to tell if it helped with people checking out the album. You can't really unless you start getting the Google pixels and stuff like that. But that's a bit too extreme. But you just gotta get, you've gotta do your, you've got to do your bet and just put the songs out there. Because the thing is that if people don't just. They can scroll past if they don't like it, you know, it's not. You should feel. I know you're naturally funny. You've done comedy and stuff like that. So the, the trick, the thing that I've always found has been more successful, although it's hard to get into that frame of mind. It's when you can come up with some sort of banner, sort of almost virally type video, something that's funny. But then it's got an advert at the end. But that the algorithm doesn't recognize this as an advert. It recognizes people would because it's getting all the laugh reacts or angry reacts or whatever it is. And it's going. This is a thing that's getting people to react emotionally and it wants people to react emotionally. So yeah, I would say just doing a daft we thing about. This is a, this is the story of me, myself. Try and keep it and do that, do that for 60 seconds. And it ends with new album out. Now. [01:14:11] Speaker B: I've done a wee video I don't know if I deal with. Do you know this guy, Stephen Kerr, the power Man? [01:14:21] Speaker C: No, I. Stephen Ken, but this sounds like a different Stephen Kerr. [01:14:27] Speaker B: It's a sports personality. He's a motivator, influencer type guy. But it's like when I first, when I first seen him and my heat, I was like, oh, he's hanging on these like these fingernails to like his sanity. But then I was like, and no, I've been too quick to Judge there. No, this guy's actually really good and he's doing a lot of good stuff and all, but he's like has stick as like come on, I want you to do it. Be powerful, be outstanding. Yes. But he's Scottish. He's Scottish, but he puts on this accent kind of thing. [01:14:59] Speaker C: So it's kind of like the. Who's the guy? Who's the famous guy that does offer the brain fart. But the guy guy, the, the motivator guy goes on Joe Rogan. [01:15:08] Speaker B: He's like, oh, he wakes up and. [01:15:12] Speaker C: Just runs every day. He's like. [01:15:16] Speaker B: He used to be in the military. Then he was, yes, David Goggins. [01:15:23] Speaker C: Now that guy's a motivated guy. It's like Mr. Motivator is a motivated guy. And that's when you know, I seen him fighting with Badly Drawn Boy. Yeah, I caused the fight. So I'm gonna, I'm actually going to do that as a petro and only story or I'll keep it for the book. [01:15:39] Speaker B: But yeah, keep that for the book, man. I would also say a lot of your stories that you've said on here, that's book worthy, man. Don't just say, oh, that's for that put, put right. Because when you write them down, when you write them, didn't you, you'll thank you things and you, you'll write it in a way that kind of best reflects on what happened when you get to actually just sit down and, and take your time on it. [01:16:02] Speaker C: Well, that's what I want to do. I'm hopefully gonna get a, a new flat. I'm still looking if anyone's knows anywhere. But yeah, hopefully in October, new flat, somewhere quiet on moon. And I'm just going to try and write the book over the winter. That's my plan. And then just wait for the ending which will either be. I remember the night at the Hack, but I was on prescriptions and overpriced beer. I got flagged by YouTube that, that comment, naughty. I don't know what does it say? What do you mean by red flag by YouTube that comment. Not sure. I don't see anything in mind. But yeah, hopefully I, I, that's the plan. Do the book and then. But I need an ending. So we're doing the Irish tour. I think it's either Europe. [01:16:45] Speaker B: Why don't you take a leaf. Sorry, I was going to say why don't you take a leaf at in Norm MacDonald's book and like just make up the ending. [01:16:57] Speaker C: That's a good idea because I can't really be bothered doing stuff. You know, if you. [01:17:04] Speaker B: If you were to write your ending. [01:17:06] Speaker C: Yeah. [01:17:07] Speaker B: If you could and you could design it. This is the way I want to go. [01:17:12] Speaker C: Look, I really. A shite gig in Aer. But obviously I could just make that dream come true. You know, I could have. I could have a gig. I could have a shake gig at your. If I wanted to. You know, that. That feels like an achievable goal. [01:17:24] Speaker B: And as storytelling, it's kind of slice of life. [01:17:27] Speaker C: But also maybe it would be funnier to do it. I just say that nobody turned it because then nobody would be there to say that it did or didn't happen because nobody was there. That's interesting. But then I don't have to put myself through the actual. The, you know, the nerves, the anxiety, the fuel, the. The feeling of failure because it. Because obviously I would. I would fight. When a gig goes bad, I do find it funny, you know, almost immediately, maybe the next day or a week later. But at the time, it hurts. It can. It can. It can sting when things go wrong. [01:17:59] Speaker B: Oh. Like when any. You know, even just. If I. If I see somebody, like, looking as if they're not enjoying themselves sometimes, that can, like, pure trigger me. Like, they hate me, they don't like me, they wish I wasn't here. I shouldn't be here. I. I'm sh. You know what I mean? But I. The also. I don't know if you've seen any of the videos that I done to promote it that were just. There's a concept I had suffering for your art. Did you see any of those? [01:18:25] Speaker C: I've seen. I seen. I've seen one, but that shows you about the algorithm. I've only seen one of them. How many have you done anything. Let's just check this out. [01:18:31] Speaker B: So I've got two. I've got another one. I'm going to bring it the motor, but I've got two. Done. And the concept behind it was suffered. You know how everybody. The tortured artist who suffers for their art. Right. They. And in the past, it was. You suffered financially, your relationship suffered. You suffered mentally, you suffered. Am I good enough? You know, are you gonna have a house, you're gonna be able to eat, all that kind of thing. But now you also suffer through exploiting yourself on as. As a musician. You've got. You're gonna go, hey, guys. Jimmy, who's a. Who's a. Hey, guys, I'm Jimmy Neal. And my new album's coming out. And especially if you're older. It's a bit. It's harder. So I wanted to sort of create because I think it's just stupid. But you need. But it's necessary. So if it's necessary. I wanted to make the videos that I was doing deliberately stupid to point that out. But most folk are just like that guy just ate a few jar of mustards. What a dickhead. [01:19:39] Speaker C: No, but it's good. It's a good idea. You've got your concept. Just run with. You just need to come up with. You just need to. The more you do it, what the. The tricky comedy is obviously repetition and see that way with. It starts getting old, but then it gets funny again. That's the best comedy for me. When you just do it so much that it's. It's no funny anymore. But then it gets fun again. You're going to see Stuart Lee, I think because I'm a big fan of Obviously. [01:20:05] Speaker B: Yeah, he's. He's a sort of master at that sort of thing. I'm trying to think of other folks that sort of do that. But I mean, but that's the thing. You. You can just be. And I suppose you've never. You never had to just be just a musician. You had to be. There's, you know, it's all big meesters. Most successful people within the creative arts that are. That are seen are usually bra. They're usually good looking. [01:20:34] Speaker C: Yeah. [01:20:35] Speaker B: Do you know what I mean? That's why I don't understand why me and you are still eating tons of beans. [01:20:44] Speaker C: Whoa. Yeah. Okay. I think there's a. There's a really good quote. I'm trying to remember what it was, but he was just. I think it was mtv, that kind of stuff. That, you know, video killed the radio star. As I say it was. It was along those lines and because before back in the day, you know, if you liked an artist, you didn't really know what they looked like until you went to a show. You know, there's lots of people. I mean, obviously I'm not. I'm too young to not really remember that. I just remember like seeing all the artists. But before then it was just. It was just a voice in the radio so you could have a face for the radio. You kick cats are saying, I'll get your night in the Abbey Gates. So what's with Abby Gates? I mean, I know what the Abby is. And that was the old. [01:21:30] Speaker B: That's the old Foundry. [01:21:32] Speaker C: The Foundry, right. Okay. Yes. So somebody has talked to me about this before. So is that. Is that a good venue to play? [01:21:41] Speaker B: I mean, back in the day I played the Foundry where an A band I was in with. We were promised jet packs. [01:21:51] Speaker C: What happened to them? They were brilliant. I remember seeing them at the 13th. [01:21:54] Speaker B: No, they're still gone. Still gone. Love them. [01:22:00] Speaker C: It's a great band. Sorry, I just haven't heard any other stuff for a while. Algorithm. They're not putting themselves out there enough. So. Yeah. So Abby Gazer. Is anybody else in Airshirt? Is there anybody else in the Usher? Because obviously I think we're banned for the hack. Also, we're not a seated band and we're not. We're not suited to that unless someone's going to do the. You know, maybe do the comeback show in a suit and a stool maybe with some double bass and that. That vibe. The Cronor era, which I would quite enjoy. Is anyone else in that could do the End the Book with. [01:22:34] Speaker B: Well, there's. Was it Studio 52 or whatever it is. The thing is, I'm the same as you. I don't. I don't mean to be down on Ayrshire, but it's just anytime I've played a gig in Ayrshire, like, nobody turns up. And John wanted to do the Mellow Party tour before we went to the States. Wanted to do a date in Ayrshire because that's my place. And I says, I don't think we should date. And he was all right. Okay. So we done it in air at this venue, which was a great venue. The sound was brilliant, it looked great. And then like 20 folk turned up and I was devastated, man. Yeah. And. But the thing is. And what's. What's sort of ungrateful about my reaction is the fact that 20 people did turn up. Yeah. And they did turn up. And you should play. Play your best for them that are there to see you instead of thinking about the folk that aren't there. [01:23:34] Speaker C: But it went wrong. Everything has went wrong. We did. We played live at Trin and they had all. They had all the big acts in the Friday and the Saturday and then they just put all the up and coming bands in the Sunday. I'll no mention the bands that were on the Sunday because one of them is actually quite famous now. But the. At that point, nobody. It was a good lineup, but it was like 30. I don't know, it was like 25 quit. This is about 10 years ago ago and everything's unknown. And we played this big massive tune hall I think should have been cancelled, man. And it was like, I don't know, five people there. And it was like an awkward. Like the school dancing where. No, everyone's scared to go up and ask someone to dance. There was like three people in that side of the bench. There's two people there, I think eventually shamed or. Or embarrassed. I got. Someday two people got to dance. And we did a song called There's Something Wrong with Us. So that day and they cut us off and then, you know that there was a gig at the Clareman or whatever that was called the time platform something. [01:24:36] Speaker B: Platform 5. Because the. Because Corning train station. It's right next to Corner street station. Train station only has four platforms and the next platform is platform five. Baby. [01:24:47] Speaker C: I'm pretty sure you were there. I think it was a Crash Club gig maybe, but maybe Cowan was on the drums that 10. And it was. Once again there was a major sound issues and we actually had quite a good turnout because between us and Crash Club, the trips were it. But then. Then the sound let us do. It was like a. It was. It wasn't the guys who brought the PA's fault. They were. They were brilliant. But it was just. It wasn't designed for live music. So therefore there was a lot of, you know, so everyone just thinks, yeah, it went bad. But like I said, I think it's a good way to end the book is just by, you know, either. It could go really well, but we know there is a. It almost feels like it's custard. I think Asa's problem is it's so close to Glasgow. You know, people always ask, you don't check me for air. And it's like, no, I live closer to Glasgow than there. Why would I go here for a night? And yeah, as soon as people are old enough to leave, they tend to leave. And it's a shame, but as I'm getting older, I've been looking at maybe going back to. I should have actually been in talks with somebody at this. Just trying to bring some live music to your sir. So that might be a new hang. It's still early days for that one. Sorry, before we go, because obviously we're getting to the half. You're. You're going. You're going to MC you. So you're going to hurry up and start moving. Hold on, we got. Get Robert a robot to promote. He always gets the likes. Now there's a good shout out. Shouts to Robert the Robot and I've got my robo. I've got my robo Crocs as well. So maybe I could get. Me and Robert the Robot could do some popping and locking together. Bring back Ruby Tuesdays. Ruby Tuesdays. I mean there was never. I never seen any live music there, but I had many good points. I actually watched Scotland beat France and we all won a bet because we don't put a. A tenor or a score of. On James McFadden to score first. [01:26:41] Speaker B: That was. That was today. That was. That was this day. That was this day when McFadden scored that screaming against France when the deal. [01:26:49] Speaker C: With Record printed the headline everyone back, it won. Now what is that? That's a weird thing to happen. And we did. We all backed it and we all got absolutely wasted that Ruby's party all night and then the next day we woke up hung over and we just collected our winnings inc. We were all, you know, I mean, picking up 100, 200 quid each. Great shows the rubies. But I think that's calling Mustard's in the house as well. Hello, Colin. Mustard and I. So Mellow Party what you got coming up because it's. That's an hour and a half and you've got. We've got a gig to go to, so. [01:27:23] Speaker B: So coming up, I'm recording new music again with JP Reed, Dragon of Marmaduke Duke and Susio Pero and yes, Dragon and Medals who recorded Maths Teacher and King of the Rats. Great producer. If anybody wants to work with him, give him a shout. He's incredible. Then I will be performing on Sunday Bom to the Wild with my Mellow Party pals and Roddy Dixon. We'll be playing an interactive theatre show, playing wolves, singing songs and taking a big walk around Voguery Pogrey park at Voglary Pogrey Festival and Edinburgh. When we talk about environment, sing songs and all this, it's really, really fun. Vulgary pokery. If you've. If anybody has children, it's great. And that's this Sunday. Then Meloparty are going to be playing at the Cumbernault Theatre in 30 August. So book your tickets up now because we want folk to come. So I was also gonna say you were talking earlier about gigging abroad and stuff like that and a wee idea, I bumped into this. I bumped in it. I discovered this website called side Door and it enables artists, you know how you go, you know, you just maybe do like house shows or back door shows or the art galleries or these three things. What's so great about them is because you get to interact with the audience, the money's a bit better. 30th of October. See, I told you. I remembered. So the Side Door acts for hosts and for artists. So you can put yourself your profile up and say for instance you've got wherever you want to do a tour or go to a certain place or even if you. You're in a certain place already, you can put up. These are the dates that I can play. [01:29:17] Speaker C: It sounds really. This sounds really good. How much is it? [01:29:20] Speaker B: It. It's free. [01:29:21] Speaker C: It's free? [01:29:22] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:29:23] Speaker C: Because there was a. Other people that used to do that but they started charging a lot of money. I can't remember the name of them but they started mail me. [01:29:30] Speaker B: It's free and it's called. It's called Side Door. So anybody. [01:29:33] Speaker C: I mean we've got, we've got actually got a couple of contacts because we actually had booked European dates before Lockdown because we were. We seen. We knew Brexit was coming in the rear view. So we'll let. Let's do it then. Lockdown ruined it. Then Brexit ruined it and now I think I'm up for it. So if anyone knows anyone, France, Spain, Holland, Germany in and just even just a few days in Spain or a few days in France would do the job to finish finally. So Side Door, I'm going to check them out definitely. In fact, while you and I think John's tuned in. So we need to get. We need to get. Get a guitar and some rucksacks. 2 Voguery Pogry because how do Bean is driving to Equinox Festival and we don't have enough space in our respective vehicles. So can we. When. When are you driving to Vogue? Poggeri, Could I give you a guitar and a rucksack and stuff to take. [01:30:36] Speaker B: Moment time. [01:30:36] Speaker C: 9:00 clock 9:00am on the sun on the Sunday. Right, Sunday. So I just need to figure out a way to get my stuff to join before Sunday and then that stuff can arrive at Equ. That means the stuff will get taken to Equinox Festival and then we don't need to worry about it anywhere. It's just that we've got. I'm not going to bore you with the details but travel logistics has been a nightmare for this festival. But we'll be there main stage a week today. Anyone in the Lincolnshire area. We've also got a couple of free tickets to give away to any of our patrons. So if you want to support. Support the [email protected] you call that radio or if you already are, then you can get two free tickets to Equinox. Just give me a shout. Go and buy Colin Hunter's album, the King of the Rats. Buy it in Band Camp, stream it on Spotify. Any closing words I'll give you. [01:31:33] Speaker B: These are my closing words. That's, that's, that's really bad, bad pattern. No, I would just like to thanks. Say thanks to you, Mark, and for everybody that's, that's been listening to the album and giving good feedback and I, I think maybe just being sincere and just saying I'm grateful for everybody listening, buying the album, coming to the shows and I'm really happy that I, I'm alive. You believe me? [01:32:06] Speaker C: Well, I'm happy you're alive. It's a brilliant new album. Go and check it out. The King of the Rats. The King of the Rats. Out now. Colin Hunter. And we're away to MC to Stephen to watch God the Duncan on the drums with Steven Young's band and the folk drama. If you listen to this in the audio podcast, you've already missed it, but you can see the Gyro Babies at Equinox Festival and we're touring Ireland, Dublin, Dundalk and Derry, November the seventh to the ninth. Go and check out Colin's album. It's brilliant. Thank you to everyone who's tuned in. Have a great weekend and I'll maybe see you at McCool's tonight if you're a bit. [01:32:45] Speaker A: Bye.